aha yes that is a good one also if i were to really think about it that is better than the 338 in some ways imo round nose just kill better i have no sientific name for it but a 45-70 slug hittin a deer.. aint no uber short fat shoulder dissloacating mag can kill a deer better than a 45-70.. the reason i kinda side with the 338 is range course there may be better range and less recoiling rouds for that but oh well..both are GREAT cals