Guys thanks for the replies, like i said dont want to steal this thread, but i think everyone could benefit from the knowledge. PAbowhnter, it was your review that pushed me to even consider the black ice, with everyone so excited about the General i was pretty much set, but you seemed to really be pleased with the black ice. I usually buy a new bow every 5 years or so, with that i do want something that i can live with. I will post where to buy the Black Ice for that cheap price once i get itdont want their stock to disappear before i can make up my mind