Here's the deal. I love collet dies. I try to use them with all my guns. But every once in a while you got to FL size at least the body, and if you get brass from somebody that has shot it in thier gun, you have to FL size. So for 300win, I decided to get a cheap set of pacesetters. First off, inside is rough, I mean very rough. Second, it pushes the shoulders back further than any other die I have seen. In my 300win, it pushes the shoulders back .02" from fireformed. Now some could say I have bad headspace. Well, we checked that, and its bang on. Ok, no problem, just set it up to partial FL, to match my shoulders with a head and shoulders gauge. Ok, now, it squeezes the neck so much, I can barely put a bullet in, and when it does, I scrape out copper, and I am deburring with a 30degree lymans tool for this purpose of smooth seating, and I am lubing the inside necks.

Lastly, bullet runout after all this mess, on all loads is between .006" to .012". I have a feeling, this is from the hard seating.

Dadgone, I try to go cheap, and save 15 dollars, and have 50 dollars of aggrivation.

So I brake down and get a set of RCBS, pushes the shoulders back only .003", fine with me. And runout is decent. All between .002" and .005".

Now, I have found a few sets of RCBS where the expander ball is too small before, but they sent me a new one. And have once saw a set that didn't push the shoudlers back near enough, but my gunsmith took a hair off, so they custom fitted my rifle. But overall, I am back buying RCBS.

But as they say, you get what you pay for.