There is this park in SE WI I used to go to before I joined the Army, and there was this buck that used to rub cedar trees on this point on a lake. They were huge. I brought my dad out there and we measured them. They all averaged about 38'' around. It was one after another. Never got a glimpse of him. Then they brought the sniper's into bring the deer heard down and the rubs stopped. They were only suppose to shoot does. HMMM