Tell me to go pound sand!

[Snook384]

or at least that is what it feels like I am doing. 3rd year for my food plot nightmares to begin and could sure use some help from you guys. I tried to do it right last year and here is how it went.

Last year:
My ph was 4.7. My food plot is right at 1/2 an acre. I added 2,600 pounds of lime and 300 pounds of 13-13-13 in two different applications 2 months apart. I also added 400 pounds of milorganite to try to run the damn deer off for a few weeks. I planted chicory (enough for 2 acres) and 100 pounds of iron clay peas (deer crack). Started great but hurricanes RUINED my plot so it went sporadic.

This year:
Just got my soil sample back and ph is 5.4!!!! Does lime go away after 10 months? Is there a way to better fix the lime in the soil or am I just going to be looking forward to putting a couple tons of lime a year on half an acre. It seems a bit over the top to me. They also had some numbers for my fertilizer and suggested around 400 pounds of 13-13-13 but said I could drop down to 10-10-10 and it would work "ok". I want to plant a plant that I do not have to keep struggling with but I seem to never find the right one. I want a pretty plot like I see you guys get but maybe I am just pissing in the wind. So here are my few questions and would like your help.

Does lime go away quick like fertilizer?

How much fertilizer do you think is reasonable for 1/2 an acre.?
Which plant would you use in NORTH FLORIDA (sorry turnips no worky here) that would help fix some nitrogen and be a little less work?

Is there that big of a difference in 13 vs 10 fertilizer (besides the obvious percentage difference) that would make it worth the price?

Thank you for your time.

Chris

[Soilman]

Your lime is still reacting with the soil. It can take years to fully adjust the pH. Your pH will probably keep going up for another 2-4 years. Lime does not react with the soil instantly to raise the pH. I wouldn't at all be worried about a pH test for several more years.

10-10-10 contains 10% N-P-K per 100 lbs fertilizer, 13-13-13 contains 13% N-P-K per 100 lbs fertilizer. At 400 lbs fertilizer, you are only getting 12 lbs of extra nutrients by using 13-13-13 over 10-10-10. That is almost no difference. That said, I prefer 46-0-0 (urea), 18-46-0 (DAP), and 0-0-60 (potash) for individual nutrients if you can get them (local coop?).

I am in the frozen north, so I will leave crop selection to those who know the South better.

[falcon]

Try the clay peas again next year and hope the hurricanes pass you by. We planted several plots of clay peas this year and they did great. The deer hit them hard and they did not mature. Those clay peas plots were planted with Austrian winter peas in September.

[farm hunter]

In Florida - I'd asssume you have some sandy soil - so generally lime will be more effective compared to on clay like soils. I've always been told that 3000 lbs/acre is about all the soil can process per year - 4.7Ph is really low. Keep in mind its 10 times more acidic than 5.7 PH (borderline for clover/chicory) ans 100 times more acidic than 6.7 which would be about perfect.

Alls I can say is soil adjustment takes time - you are on the right track- keep at it.

In the south - with a changing Ph in the soil - Crimson Clover can be a good soil builder and choice. Plant it as an annual and re-evaluate next year.

Good luck -

FH

[gregrn43]

Soilman is right on the way he explained it to you. As far as what seeds to plant, here in north Arkasas I plant either winter rye or buck forage oats mixed with rape and clover. Since you say turnips wont grow there you may not have much luck with rape. I would contact your county extension agent and asked for advice.

[7MMXBOLT]

Here check this site out they may have some answers for you that could help.

http://www.qdma.com/articles/details.asp?id=15

I'm not much of a farmer so I decided to try "Mineral Stations" this coming spring. We'll see how that goes!

[haystack]

Originally Posted by Snook384

or at least that is what it feels like I am doing. 3rd year for my food plot nightmares to begin and could sure use some help from you guys. I tried to do it right last year and here is how it went.

Last year:
My ph was 4.7. My food plot is right at 1/2 an acre. I added 2,600 pounds of lime and 300 pounds of 13-13-13 in two different applications 2 months apart. I also added 400 pounds of milorganite to try to run the damn deer off for a few weeks. I planted chicory (enough for 2 acres) and 100 pounds of iron clay peas (deer crack). Started great but hurricanes RUINED my plot so it went sporadic.

This year:
Just got my soil sample back and ph is 5.4!!!! Does lime go away after 10 months? Is there a way to better fix the lime in the soil or am I just going to be looking forward to putting a couple tons of lime a year on half an acre. It seems a bit over the top to me. They also had some numbers for my fertilizer and suggested around 400 pounds of 13-13-13 but said I could drop down to 10-10-10 and it would work "ok". I want to plant a plant that I do not have to keep struggling with but I seem to never find the right one. I want a pretty plot like I see you guys get but maybe I am just pissing in the wind. So here are my few questions and would like your help.

Does lime go away quick like fertilizer?

How much fertilizer do you think is reasonable for 1/2 an acre.?
Which plant would you use in NORTH FLORIDA (sorry turnips no worky here) that would help fix some nitrogen and be a little less work?

Is there that big of a difference in 13 vs 10 fertilizer (besides the obvious percentage difference) that would make it worth the price?

Thank you for your time.

Chris

First, I hate to be the one to say it, but you wasted some very expensive chicory seed. The Cowpeas is a good idea, even at that high of a seed rate, but they will smother out the chicory, which can live for a few years.

I think you're good on the lime also. Sandy soil has a faster reaction time to lime, but it won't "store" it as long as clay based soils. You should still be good for at least 3 years maybe more, food plots don't deplete the soil of nutrients as fast as crop land does because you're not removing tons of bio-mass.

Farm Hunter mentioned Crimson Clover as a soil builder, very good idea. The more organic material you can incorporate into your soil the better, your soil will hold moisture better and legumes such as clover and cowpeas will add nitrogen credits, reducing or eliminating the need for additional fertilizer.

Another option would be to plant Buckwheat this spring and till/disk it in right before it blooms/flowers usually less than 6 weeks. Then repeat the process once again, timing it so after tilling in the buckwheat, you have time to plant Oats and possibly Red Clover (Southern Belle) this fall. The Red Clover should last 2 to 3 years and be very low maintenance, and a superb deer attractant.

[Remnard]

Originally Posted by Snook384

or at least that is what it feels like I am doing. 3rd year for my food plot nightmares to begin and could sure use some help from you guys. I tried to do it right last year and here is how it went.

Last year:
My ph was 4.7. My food plot is right at 1/2 an acre. I added 2,600 pounds of lime and 300 pounds of 13-13-13 in two different applications 2 months apart. I also added 400 pounds of milorganite to try to run the damn deer off for a few weeks. I planted chicory (enough for 2 acres) and 100 pounds of iron clay peas (deer crack). Started great but hurricanes RUINED my plot so it went sporadic.

This year:
Just got my soil sample back and ph is 5.4!!!! Does lime go away after 10 months? Is there a way to better fix the lime in the soil or am I just going to be looking forward to putting a couple tons of lime a year on half an acre. It seems a bit over the top to me. They also had some numbers for my fertilizer and suggested around 400 pounds of 13-13-13 but said I could drop down to 10-10-10 and it would work "ok". I want to plant a plant that I do not have to keep struggling with but I seem to never find the right one. I want a pretty plot like I see you guys get but maybe I am just pissing in the wind. So here are my few questions and would like your help.

Does lime go away quick like fertilizer?

How much fertilizer do you think is reasonable for 1/2 an acre.?
Which plant would you use in NORTH FLORIDA (sorry turnips no worky here) that would help fix some nitrogen and be a little less work?

Is there that big of a difference in 13 vs 10 fertilizer (besides the obvious percentage difference) that would make it worth the price?

Thank you for your time.

Chris

You probably have sandy soils. I am surprised at your ph levels because your whole state is pretty much made of coral which typically has a good ph. did you do a ph test before and after the lime application? It can take 6 months or longer for the lime to really get in to the soil. maybe it hasnt been there long enough combined with the hurricane washing some out is whats keeping your tests low.

Sandy soils have the unfortunate effect of leaching nutrients etc. very quickly. You should need 1 ton of lime per acre to raise the ph one point. so you should have more than enough of that. if you have had a lot of rain and a hurricane definitely falls under that category, it can leach lime and macro and micro nutrients out rather quickly.

I would suggest raising the organic matter in the soil. this will give your soil moisture and nutrient retention qualities. Bark mulch, ground leaves, cow manure all work well for this. stay away from horse manure as it will have a high fescue content which is hell to get rid of. watch your nitrogen addition as that will give the weeds a shot at over taking the plot.

[timbercruiser]

We have sandy soils in N.W. Fl and South Bama and my favorite seeds to plant for a fall plot is Buck Forage Oats with overseed of Yucci Arrowleaf clover. My clover next summer will be close to waist high, then we turn it in and it comes back again next fall.