What kind of speed would you expect from this setup

[Mike from Texas]

Hoyt Razortec, 30" draw, 73#, ACC 3-60, 100 grain tips, 4" feathers, peep no tubing, 1 brass nock + eliminator button. Arrow weight of ~415 grains.


Bowtech Patriot single or Extreme VFT with the same setup.

[buckeye]

Well I can tell you from my Extreme what i get for speed.

29 inch draw length
400 grain goldtip XT 7595
71.5 # draw weight
Kisser, peep and D loop
291 FPS

With a 400 grain arrow and a 30 inch draw you would be flirting with if not hitting 300 FPS with your hunting setup.

[Mike from Texas]

Wow Buckeye, your all over my posts tonight.

Thanks for the replies. I saw a post on Bowsite.com from a guy saying he is getting 293 fps out of a Razortec with the above mentioned setup. It is a hard decision for me between the Razortec and the Patriot single or Extreme VFT. I originally went in pretty closed minded about the Hoyt bows but was very suprised after shooting one. I'm really wanting to get around 300 fps out of my rig, but I'm not gonna lose any sleep over a few fps.

Maybe I'm trying to talk myself out of the Hoyt? Who knows. I didn't realize the decision would be this difficult quite honestly. I was that impressed with the Hoyt.

[bobcat 10]

all i hear and seen is when you shoot a bowtech or just touch a bowtech you cannot just let go of the bow...you know what they say shoot a bowtech today ....and your gonna end up with a bowtech......good luck on your decision....

[Matt / PA]

Mike not sure of the Razortec, but I can help with the Patriot and the Extreme VFT.

At 73# for the arrow weight listed at 415grs you are 50grs over the IBO test rating.

If you consider the IBO Speed rating for the 2 bows we can make a pretty decent guess as to what they would do set up as you describe

These singles lose about 1fps for every 3+grs of arrow weight gained over the IBO rating for a particular draw weight.
Since you are 50grs over you can scrub about 16fps+/- from the advertised speed right off the bat.
Add in your peep and drop maybe another 3-5fps (really depends upon style) The Tru-peeps are small and light, but some other models are quite heavy.
For sanity sake we'll say 4fps.
Since BowTech test shoots their bows with a factory installed "Hush Kit" as well as a brass nock set and E-Buttons, you aren't losing any extra speed over what you plan on shooting.

The speed ratings for each bow:
Patriot VFT= 320-328fps
Extreme VFT= 325-333fps

So with your set-up it's reasonable to expect:
Patriot VFT @ 300-308fps
Extreme VFt @ 305-313fps

Take a middle of the road number and you are probably looking at 304ish for the Patriot and 309ish for the Extreme VFT with your 415gr arrow.

I don't see any problems with penetration anywhere in your immediate future.


Any additional questions just shoot......(just in my general direction, not actually AT me. [:-])

[PABowhntr]

I have been doing some rather extensive testing with some of my bows and chronographs lately. Based on my results I would expect the Patriot speed to be in the 295-300 fps range 300-305 fps out of the EX VFT with that particular setup.

I shot an Xtec through the chrono at the same time I was shooting both of the Bowtech bows. With nothing on the string but a single brass nockset and the two factory installed string leeches it shot between279-281 fps with a 418 grain arrow....70 lb draw weight and a 30 inch draw length. Both the Xtec and the Razortec have the same IBO rating so you may be able to generalize to some extent from there.

[Mike from Texas]

Thanks Matt & PA Bowhunter. Interesting. I'm trying to build a spreadsheet to calculate speed and kinetic energy. What reduction in speed do you think one could expect from the following string accessories (on average).

Brass knock (each)
Eliminator button (each)
TRU Speed nock
Leeches
Cat whiskers
String Loop
Kisser Button


Draw length adjustment (on average 1" = ????)


Any other input would be greatly appreciated. That's all of the strings add ons that I can think of right now. It's still early, I'm still on the 1st cup of coffee. Have a great day guys.

[CBM SC]

Pabwhntr , That is about what I would expect for the speeds too !

Mike , From what I have seen or heard :

Brass nock or eliminator buttons = 1-3 fps
Speed nocks = depends on where you put them...could be an increase or decrease
leeches= 1-2 fps
catwiskers= 3-6 fps
loop=1-2 fps
kisser button= 2 fps

draw length = 10-12 fps per inch
draw weight= 2 fps per pound
arrow weight= every 3-5 grains = 1 fps
Hope that helps !!

[PABowhntr]

I would agree with CBM SC's estimates on the various string accessories with some small difference in regard to such things as cat whiskers since some folks like to load them up and position them more towards the center of the bowstring. This can reduce speed significantly.

It is funny how the grains per pound ratio can directly affect the rate at which arrow speed increases or decreases with any given change in arrow weight.

For example, when going from 6.5 to 5 grains per pound of draw weight with two specific arrows I noted a 1 fps increase in arrow speed for every 3 grains of arrow weight decreased. However, when going from 7.5 to 6.5 grains per pound of draw weight the ratio dropped to a 1 fps increase for every 5 grains of arrow weight decreased.

Not what I had expected.

[Mike from Texas]

ORIGINAL: CBM SC

Pabwhntr , That is about what I would expect for the speeds too !

Mike , From what I have seen or heard :

Brass nock or eliminator buttons = 1-3 fps
Speed nocks = depends on where you put them...could be an increase or decrease
leeches= 1-2 fps
catwiskers= 3-6 fps
loop=1-2 fps
kisser button= 2 fps

draw length = 10-12 fps per inch
draw weight= 2 fps per pound
arrow weight= every 3-5 grains = 1 fps
Hope that helps !!

Thanks that will help.

On the speed nock though, it's not the rubber speed balls like your thinking. It actually replaces the brass nock set and helps keep your peep from rolling on you. Nevermind, I just answered my own question, it appers that they weigh the same as a standard brass nock. See them here

On the leeches, are you saying 1-2 fps EACH or for a set? I had estimated an average of 6 fps for a set (pair) of them. Almost got the spreadsheet done. Thanks for all of the info.