My current bow set up produces 70' #s of ke. According to the easton recommendation chart, that' s enough to hunt the largest of game. I should be happy. Of course, I probably would be if momentum weren' t constantly haunting me...
Dr. Ashton' s study recommends a momentum of .57 to greatly increase penetration potential for a killing shot. Of course, this is on the largest game, which I don' t intend to hunt. I tried to think of a way to extrapolate this to whitetails, and came up with the following.
Easton' s KE chart recommends 41' #s for whitetails and 65' #s up for large game. The whitetail recommendation is 63% of the large game recommendation. Following this through to momentum, 63% of .57 is .36. My current set up produces .48.
So, do you think a recommendation of 41' #s of ke and .36 of momentum makes sense for whitetails? Is anything above this set up gravy, or allow one to use larger cut broadheads?
Based on this, shouldn' t one choose the smoothest drawing easiest shooting bow available? And which one is it?
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Genesis 27:3
"œNow then, get your weapons "” your quiver and bow "” and go out to the open country to hunt some wild game for me."
I really think you put too much tought into things
I just wonder if in the old days the Indians worried so much about their set up.
Did they weight each arrow or worry about how much that flintstone head weighed.
What was the exact poundage of their bows? What is my KE?
Now these same Indians took Buffalo,Elk,Deer and also the white man with their set ups.
In that fact the longbow archers from the medieval times as well.
They knew exactly where to put the arrow to do maximum damage.
You could almost bet your last dollar that the above did not have 2 arrows that weighed the same or 2 bows with the same draw weight.
I really dont hold too much faith into all these new formulas for momentium, ke and such.
But more into shot placement based on the tried and true methods of our fore fathers.
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Ignorance is content to stand still with its back to the truth.
I admire your creative thinking. The only problem that I see with your hypothesis is that you are trying to equate specific ratios of momentum and kinetic energy. Where I might see a potential fault is in the issue of keeping the same percentage when switching from KE to momentum. I am unsure if it is possible to compare the two in the way that you have attempted. Admittedly, I do not have an extensive amount of knowledge concerning physics, etc.. to be able to determine if your hypothesis is actually true.
Ausie, but if they DID, perhaps we' d all still be wearing armor or sitting in tee pees smoking peace pipes whilst the squaws do all the work
Frank, I have no idea either, which is why I asked. On the surface, it would seem to make sense, but who knows? I have a gut feeling it may be valid, but then again, it could just be the lack of breakfast
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Genesis 27:3
"œNow then, get your weapons "” your quiver and bow "” and go out to the open country to hunt some wild game for me."
Aussie, I couldn' t agree more. However, there' s a big difference between the old English cloth yard ash arrow with grey goose quill fletching and 4" wide iron broadheads, weighing between 1200 and 1500 grains, and a 350 grain carbon arrow with a mechanical. Even the Indians' shoot or cane arrows and stone points were pretty heavy, in comparison.
Good thing they didn' t use sights or they couldn' t have shot worth a flip with those arrows and the human race would have gone extinct.
Rangeball, I really would like to go at least one week without getting into trouble. But, if you insist....
As far as the 41 ft lbs minimum for deer hunting, no. It doesn' t make sense. 40-45 pound recurves used to be very popular deer hunting bows, with cedar arrows and cut on contact broadheads. If you figured the KE for those bows, they were lucky to be getting 30-35 ft lbs. However, their arrows carried a good bit of weight so they were effective.
Now, it must be understood that, at the time, popular thinking was to keep the broadhead inside the chest, so that it would keep slashing and cutting the vitals as the deer ran and cause a quick kill. It works.
Now, if you' re talking about getting enough oomph for a passthru, then MAYBE 41 ft lbs would do it, as long as you' re also talking a cut on contact broadhead. When you' re looking at minimums, then you have to really look at the entire setup. Minimum KE means a good cut on impact head, an arrow that will give you high momentum and, most important, accurate shot placement are all CRITICAL.
Yeah, I know. Someone' s going to bust my chops and say that Joe and Sam have taken 3,649 2/3 deer between them with 300 grain arrows, mechanical heads and 40 pound draw bows, all wound up with their nocks buried 2 1/2 feet under the mud, and they had to dig them up with their bare hands and the deer all dropped dead on the spot, etc, etc and, of course, etc.
Well, I know guys who take their deer every year with .22 Hornets. Does that make the .22 Hornet THE deer load for everyman?
I do think your .36 lb secs for momentum would be a decent enough minimum for deer, again with the same conditions as for minimums on KE. It would be enough for a clean kill. Enough for a complete passthru? That depends.
I' ve seen many, many shots with much more energy and momentum than we' re talking about that did not pass thru, even when no major bones got involved.
Really, just focusing on KE and momentum is simplifying things far too much.
I don' t know, maybe overcomplicating things is where the fun in hunting is for you, but you are way over thinking all this. If you spent as much time scouting, practicing, and hunting as you do worrying about your KE, then you could answer all of these questions yourself, because you would actually be running an arrow through one and deciding for yourself. I have seen my ex-girlfriend get a pass thru with a whopping 31 foot pounds of KE. Use good sharp broadheads and and hit them in the boiler room and they are going to die. Use the rest of your time and energy trying to figure out how and where to kill them.
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"Protect your hunting rights, " Spay or neuter a liberal."
At what point... a philisophical discussion
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