my bear whitetail 2, need some advice.

[jmax857]

So I have a old bear whitetail 2 I bought when I was 16, I planned on hunting whitetail here in northern ontario. I was never confident enough with it to take it hunting, so Its sat in the closet. And I hunted the late season with the muzzleeloader. I'm 23 now and since then I have harvested a fair share of deer since then, and since this year I was layed off, I figured I would pull out the bow and hopefully get some extra time in the stand. I was using aluminum 2216 arrows, with 125 grain broadheads. Its outfitted with a peep and a browning fiber optic sight. I practiced for a few days, did a couple different things, and got shooting good groups at 20 yards. I didn't feel comfortable shooting much farther, so I was limited to about 20 yards.
I had a few nice bucks coming to my stand, but after sitting on the stand for all 2 weeks of muzzleloader, and a week of bow, the bucks were sttill nocturnal. There was a small fawn I had been watching coming in time after time with no doe accompaning it when I was on the stand, or on the ca. I assumed it wouldn't make it through the winter by itself, so on the last evening of bow I decided to fill my doe tag.

This fawn was a dead on 20 yards away, slightly quartered away from me. It was just smelling the feed when I set the pin on, I let out a bleat, and letoff right behind the front shoulder. As soon as my bowstring snapped the deer jumped to the left, my arrow was dead on target, but between the time of my bow snap and the arrow hit, it was almost facing away and I hit it in the front of the back leg, and the arrow carried through the ribs on the other side
The arrow passed through the whole deer and stuck into the ground on the other side. I spent 3 hours tracking this deer, and finally found it with a dog, because there was not much of a blood trail. The deer ran over 300 yards from where I shot it. As a hunter I am not happy with my inhumane killing of this deer, and even though I was successful in killing my first deer with a bow, I am not satisfied with how it happened.

The problem i have is the speed of the bow, and the loudness of the snap. I like the accuracy of the bow, and I know that it will easily kill deer, and that's what its for.
I know someones going to say "sell it and buy a new one" but I can't, its use this or don't bow hunt.
So how much speed will I get switching from aluminum and 125 grain, to carbon and 100 grain. Also my poundage adjust is 1.5 turns out, I will be turning them in all the way. It is a 60 lb bow.
Secondly, how can I make it quieter, it has string quietners. But what can I put on the limbs and cables to quiet this puppy up.
Thirdly, the draw length is just a hair too long for me, how (if) can I adjust this? I was thinking of puttimg a new string on, so maybe I could put on a slightly shorter string?

Here's a couple pics.




Any input is appreciated, I know a lot of you guys started with these compounds, and have lots of expierience witth them, and I know a lot of game has been harvested with these puppies.

One more thing, I'm burning that flippin flipper rest!!!!

[hookeye]

People use older bows than that and kill deer, probably don't bleat at them before releasing though

Didn't see a spacer on your cables. Even with a cable rod slide they might touch each other up where they cross over. Saunders use to make a little clip to keep them apart.

FWIW you'll lose poundage with a shorter string on that bow. Small drawlength adjustments can be made with the yokes, but IIRC the cams had modules (if not that model the next version of it).

You shooting with a mechanical release or fingers?

[jmax857]

I'm shooting with fingers, the reason I want to shorten the draww length is so I can use a relase. The length is a little bit long for me, and it works just dandy with fingers, but its too akward with a release. What are the "yokes"?. There is a piece of plastic seperating where the cables cross the metal guide thing. And I realize after letting out a big bleat to get its attention and stop is probably a bad idea, haha. I see you can buy stuff that sticks to your limbs to make it quieter, does it work? Or is my bow always going to bee loud?

[BGfisher]

One thing you can do is remove the quiver and shoot the bow.See if this helps make it more quiet. Quivers are notorious noise makers. Going to carbon arrows (lighter) will net more speed, but then the noise level goes up. Something to consider.

It could be that the bow isn't tuned well and the arrows are hitting the rest or riser. Getting the cams timed well can alleviate some noise as can tuning the bow/arrow combination.

You can install Limb Savers and a decent stabilizer (Simms S-Coil won't break the bank). Maybe install a set of Cat Whiskers on the cables. These won't adversely affect the speed. Any or all of these things will help absorb bow vibration and reduce noise somewhat.

I wouldn't be so quick to buy new arrows (carbon) till you address the noise issue and get it within acceptable limits.

And in the future don't bleat at a deer that is almost motionless. All you accomplish is alerting the deer to something foreign. Keep 'em relaxed and just make a good shot.

And for what it's worth congrats on your deer and I applaud your concern to become a better hunter.

[jmax857]

The quiver I remove as soon as I am in my stand, I just sorta use it to carry my arrows around. My dad knows a guy who owns a bow shop, and he's "donating" me a whisker bisquit, and some carbon arrows.your right on the money with the arrow rest, the fletching lightly touches the side, and when the arrow rides on the rest it makes noise too. As far as limb savers, what exactly do they do?
And how could I "tune" the cams myself?
And someone told me that they were cam-pulleys if it makes a difference.
Someone also told me, if you get an old bow like this shooting too fast it could break a limb?

[hookeye]

Another thing that might help the bow overall, in feel and less noise, is a dampener between your stabilizer and riser (handle). The stabilizer you have appears to be an old Easton.

It's more of a counterweight really. It has minimal flex capability.

Cobra makes/made a rubber bushing deal, that screwed into your bow, the stabilizer screwed into it. Wallyworld used to sell them a few yrs ago for around 6-8 bucks.

Other places make similar devices, but they cost more. You should find a Cobra somewhere at a great price.

That and the small Saunders clip that rides on one cable, lets the other slide through, you put where they cross over. Those would be my two choices of upgrade at minimal cost.

If you shoot too light of an arrow, which might make it substantially faster, that will be hard on the limbs, cables etc. It's not the speed per se, but how you got it

A regular carbon of proper spine would be fine, 100gr to 125 gr tip (prefer 125).

I still like aluminum, and if you got 'em might as well shoot 'em. Was just saying a 50gr or so lighter carbon shouldn't blow your bow up, unless something was about to give already.

[BGfisher]

Originally Posted by jmax857

The quiver I remove as soon as I am in my stand, I just sorta use it to carry my arrows around. My dad knows a guy who owns a bow shop, and he's "donating" me a whisker bisquit, and some carbon arrows.your right on the money with the arrow rest, the fletching lightly touches the side, and when the arrow rides on the rest it makes noise too. As far as limb savers, what exactly do they do?
And how could I "tune" the cams myself?
And someone told me that they were cam-pulleys if it makes a difference.
Someone also told me, if you get an old bow like this shooting too fast it could break a limb?

Limb Savers are soft rubber. What they do is absorb some of the vibration created by the bow when shot reducing the amount of vibration that tarvels through the limbs to the riser, thus less noise. Also by absorbing some of the vibration it helps with longevity of the limbs.

It's pretty hard to get an older bow shooting too fast to break a limb, but care should be taken when choosing arrows. The arrow is what is supposed to absorb most of the bow's energy. Older bows didn't have such good modern limb technology so don't push it too hard for speed. You can put arrows together or have them done so they are light and fast, but don't go nuts.

With most modern bows it is recommended that you maintain at least 5 grains of arrow weight per pound of draw weight. Back a decade ago the standard was 6 gr/lb. Don't confuse this with grains per inch of arrow weight. Grains per pound refers to total arrow weight in reference to the bow's draw weight. You have to pick a shaft that is the proper spine for the length and draw weight. Then you have to figure the shaft weight per inch multiplied by the shaft length. Add to this the weight of the nock, fletching, insert and point for total arrow weight.

In your case, you would want an arrow that weighs 360 grains or more. Subtract about 150gr for the arrow components (average weights) and the bare shaft needs to weigh 210 gr or more. Assuming a 28" shaft it would have to tip the scales at 7.5 gr/in. Most hunting shafts of proper spine would be greater than this (8.4 gr and up) so it's not much of a concern. This just for your education.

Now what spine to choose? Considering that same 60# and approximately 28-29" a 400 spine should work well. Decent shafts that don't hammer the wallet would be Gold Tip Expedition 5575.

As for cam timing? Take it to a shop and let them look at it. Your bow has steel cables and there's only so much you can do with your limited experience.

One other thing I noticed from the pictures. The cables look like they are pretty close to the limb groove. Possibly when shot they are traveling forward enough to hit the limbs. This could be part of the noise problem. Could be the string has stretched over time reducing the brace height. Maybe a new string is in order.

Hope this gets you on your way. I understand that not everybody can afford a new bow. You were right. Those old relics killed a lot of deer and can continue to do so.

[jmax857]

Thanks a lot for all the great advice guys!
As far as taking my bow to my local bow shop, I may not have much expierience with bows. But I'm a mechanic by trade, and when it comes to "hands on" stuff I would rather take the time to learn and understand how to do it. As far as the bow shop, there's only one in my town,I know the guy personally and I wouldn't let him touch my wheelbarrrow with a ten foot pole. the next closest is about 2 hours away. Any info on "tuning" or a link to a manual even (which I cannot find over the net) I would appreciate a ton!

[hookeye]

Cable spacer/ silencer is by Neet now:

http://www.blackbearsportinggoods.co...llnet77900.htm

If your string is fairly new it can be twisted a few times to get your cam rotation and brace correct. Dacron B50 can stretch a bit.

If the string is of unknown age I'd get a new string before starting the tuning process.
Generic B50 strings should be around $10 IIRC.

It sucks but there's no sense in blowing a bow up, hurting yourself or losing an arrow over risking the use of an old string.

If your string is good then you could still use a spare, and you'll need one to take your other one off for twist or relax for cat whisker or peep installations -kinda neat having those old dual teardrop cables for that

[jmax857]

That cable spacer is purdy cool, I guess them steel cables slappin around would make a ton of noise. And I can put string style silencers on my cables too?