Ancient Archer

I just reduced the DW on my bow from 60# to 50# to alleviate shoulder symptoms. So, I’ve been re-tuning my bow and did some bare shaft tuning today at 15 yards. Porpoising was quickly corrected by adjusting the nock down a bit, but correcting for fishtailing is a totally different situation.

Equipment:
2008 60# Bowtech Commander, 27 ½” DL, 27 ½” Easton N-Fused 400 Axis arrows (9.0 gpi), 2” Blazers, 100gn tips.

Bare Shaft Tuning:
• BH, tiller, ATA, centershot, cam timing, drop away rest, and clearances are all to spec.
• Did not paper tune.
• For each test, 3 fletched and 2 unfletched arrows were shot.
• Fletched arrows impacted well on a vertical line.
• Bare shaft arrows were hitting about 4” to the left of the vertical line, indicating a stiff arrow, with the nock end level and to the right at about a 45° angle - really surprised at the angle of the arrow - can see the arrow fishtail during its flight, even at 15 yds.
• Continued testing resulted in the DW being increased all the way back to 60#, not what I wanted.
• Bare shafts were still impacting to the left 2”-3” with the nock severely to the right as before.
• Reduced the DW back down to 50# - much more comfortable at this weight and I don’t get the shoulder symptoms.
• Then tried 125gn field points last night at 10 yds (indoor range) - impact was 2” left & the angle was not quite as severe as before, but still visually excessive. This would suggest things are about back to where I started, but a touch better with the heavier tips.
• Could try a weaker spine arrow, but the .400 is recommended by Easton, and I’d like to keep using the same arrows – I like the Axis and really don’t want to buy any more arrows.

Questions/Comments:
• Really surprised at the angle of impact – is this normal flight for a bare shaft (flying without control from the fletching), or is it all about the stiffness of the arrow?
• Is there an alternative to a weaker arrow?
• Do any of you have suggestions that might correct this situation?

Thanks for your help.

kwilson16

You could shoot a longer shaft in the same spine...this would mean buying new shafts which might not be good choice. You could buy a half dozen to experiment.

Do broadheads impact with field points with fletched arrows?

bigcountry

Bottom line is 400 spined shafts work good for 60lb draw at 28-29", but is way too stiff for 50lbs. My programs like AA and ontarget says your overspined. Nothing you can do except put a heavier head on. I shoot BH's from 100gr to 220gr. They are out there.

I mean, your seeing the effects right now to verify.

UncleNorby

you shouldn't be surprised your arrows are stiff since you dropped 10 lbs in draw weight. Also, you may have the centershot "to spec" but that does not mean you could not make an adjustment.

To me the best and easiest thing to do is to get some arrows with the correct spine.

cptleo1

Keep adding screw in weights to the insert.

You can get them from Easton.

A lot cheaper than new arrows.

She will come around sooner or later.

Good Luck.

Ancient Archer

I just picked up (3) Easton N-Fused 500 Axis uncut arrows hoping that these weaker spined arrows would solve the tuning problems I was having with the 400 Axis arrows after dropping the DW from 60lbs to 50lbs.

My normal arrow length is 27 1/2", but I made these 28" lg with the same fletching and same 100gn tips as the 400 spine 27 1/2" long Axis arrows. I hoped this would result in a weak arrow nock tear, expecting that I would have to cut them shorter as I paper tuned them.

However, after shooting the first (3) 500 arrows at a distance of 4'-5', I got the same 1/2" right nock tear as with the 400 arrows. This was NOT really what I was expecting.

My plan of action:

• Shoot a bunch more 500 arrows to make sure my form is not causing this problem.
• Shorten (1) of the 500 arrows to 27 1/2" lg, same as my 400 arrows, and see what this does. My concern is that shortening the arrow length will stiffen the arrow and worsen the right nock tear problem. But, hopefully with playing with the rest, this will show some improvement in the nock tear.
• Once again I'll ask you guys for your opinions. You've been helpful with your recommendations.

Thanks.

bigcountry

You definately should be a tad weak with 500's . That doesn't mean you will always show weak with paper.

What does bare shaft at 30 yards show? Also, I found with binary cams, you cannot always get a bow to bareshaft to match up with BH tune, especially if there is cam lean which seems to be the norm with binary. I had 3 binarys. One, a commander had zero lean, and bare shafted beautifully, guardian and sentinel had bad lean, and always showed weak spined with bareshaft, but not BH tune no matter what you did. Got rid of both.

The bottom line is 500spine cut to 27" should be perfect for that bow.


Have you tried slightly moving the rest to the left? Are you sure no vane contact? Look at a nocked arrow from behind, do the vanes have clearance to get past the cables? If not, try to rotate to get best clearance.

The Rev

Or you can get some Muzzy Phantom 220 gn. broad heads, I love em.. They are hard to find. I get them on ebay for about 25 bucks for three.. Awesome cut on contact .040 thick. That's the head I have on my home page on my website.

bigcountry

I got 5 packs on bay. Getting harder to get. Awesome head.