What is the meaning of Baptism ?

[SFC Retired]

Matthew 3:3
"For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias (Isaiah also speaks of John the Baptist) saying, `The voice of one crying in the wilderness, `Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.'"

Matthew 3:6
"And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins."
Can you think of any other subject in Christianity that will cause more controversy, more anger, more disruption of fellowship and more everything else that you can think of, than baptism? Now there's something wrong when something can cause such division amongst believers. It's because we have so many different views of this baptism. Some feel that it's mandatory for salvation. Some, that it has nothing to do with salvation. Some in sprinkling, some in immersion. So you have all of these conflicting ideas, and I think it's a pity.

Now we are going to see what the Scripture says. But here, John no doubt about it, maintains that if these Jews of Israel are going to show saving faith in the fact that their King and Kingdom is here, then they would have to show it with the baptism of repentance. And that is why it is always called the "Baptism of Repentance." The two could not be separated. These Jews were repenting then of their failure of the system of law, and everything else. They were now preparing their hearts and minds for the King and His Kingdom. Why baptism? Now remember that we are dealing with the Jew, and if you go back to the Old Testament economy, in order for the priest to be prepared for service the first thing they had to do was wash, wash, and wash some more. They had lots of practice at washing. Throughout the whole system of the Law of Moses there was that constant washing to show to the very mind of Israel that sin was a filthy thing. This is what we are dealing with here. Sin!

That is why leprosy is used as a picture of sin. Now most of us don't know how horrible a man with leprosy can look, especially in the final stages. It is beyond comprehension. And that's what sin does. Naaman, the Syrian General, had leprosy and the servant just begged him to go to the prophet of Israel and be healed. So he ends up with Elisha, and the old prophet doesn't even come but rather sends his own servant out, and tells this big Syrian General to do what? Go dip in the Jordan River seven times. Well he finally did, and what happened? He was healed of his leprosy. Now the water didn't do it. God did it because Naaman, as reluctant as he was, was still exercising faith. But that dipping in the Jordan River indicated a cleansing. In the same way, the priesthood with their wash, wash, wash, were merely emphasizing their need for a spiritual cleansing. The water in no way could do that. Israel was told that every Jew was to be a priest of God. What little rite had to happen before they would be ready for a priesthood? They had to be washed. And they experienced that symbolic washing with their baptism. Now that is all you can put on it. Nothing more!

I guess one of the biggest questions has been, "Why was Jesus baptized? He didn't have any sin to repent of." But again, He came to be a prophet, priest, and King, and in order to fulfill all of the requirements of the priesthood again, symbolically what did He have to experience? The washing. So as He went down into that baptism in the Jordan, he symbolically fulfilled the washing of the priesthood, and at the same time He identifies Himself with His Covenant people the Nation of Israel.

I Corinthians 12:12,13
For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit."

Now, does the Holy Spirit baptize with water? No! So, this is not talking about water baptism, yet nearly every Christian group will not accept a person for membership without water baptism. Do you really believe that every member in your congregation is a born again child of God? Of course not! There are still people coming into every group who are totally unsaved; they're baptized and they are members there, but they are not members of the Body of Christ. There will be no unbelievers in the Body of Christ because that's the work of the Holy.

Romans 6:4
"Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: (many people will disagree, but I'm convinced this is not a water baptism. Water baptism cannot do what Paul is talking about here.) that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life."

No baptism can give new life. Only the power of God can do that.So I am convinced, that this is Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Paul speaks of this in I Corinthians Chapter 12. This is what I consider the only valid baptism for us in this Age of Grace. And it's a baptism that human hands cannot touch; it's a baptism that a lost person can have no part in.

I Corinthians 12:12,13
"For as the body (that is this human body. In other words from head to toe, we are controlled by one central nervous system, one mind, one brain) is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body (ten fingers and toes if we are normal): so also is Christ."

And here Paul is referring to the Body of Christ. Now, verse 13, and this may shock some people, but again I'm not changing or twisting the wording, we are going to leave it exactly where it sits.

I Corinthians 12:13
"For by one Spirit (notice that Spirit is capitalized, so it is in reference to the Holy Spirit.) are we (and remember Paul always writes to believers. What's the next word?) all(not just a favorite few, or a special elite, but how many? All. But of course that's according to God's determination of who is a believer, whether weak or strong, spiritual or carnal) baptized into one body," So reading the verse again: "For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit."
Let me qualify the Body of Christ, which of course came on the scene in the New Testament, I think after Pentecost. Some people disagree with me, and that's fine. But you search the Scriptures until you are sure you can prove me wrong. But I'm convinced that the Body of Christ didn't necessarily begin at Pentecost, because Pentecost was strictly a Jewish holiday, with a Jewish message. When the Gospel of Grace begins to go out to both Jew and Gentile, especially at the church in Antioch, in Acts Chapter 11, where it says that the believers at Antioch were the first to be called Christians; this was about 10 years after Pentecost.

That's where they were first called Christians. Not the Jewish believers in Jerusalem in those previous years. But when Gentiles started coming in by faith in the Gospel of the grace of God, they were now called Christians as the Scriptures says, so that's where I feel the Body of Christ began when Paul begins to preach this message of Christ's death, burial, and resurrection. And by faith and faith alone without the Law, and as men and women began to believe that, then the Holy Spirit baptized, or placed them, into the Body of Christ, the Church. Only the saved go into the Body of Christ. So this is where I get the premise, that the only baptism that really counts for eternity is this one.

con;t next page....

[SFC Retired]

Ephesians 4:4,5
"There is one body, (The Body of Christ) and one Spirit, (The Holy Spirit) even as ye are called in one hope of your calling. One Lord, one faith, one baptism," How many? ONE. Do you see that?

So you can have your name on as many church rolls as you wish. But unless you are in the Body of Christ you are doomed. The Scripture makes it so plain. But if you are a child of God, you are in the Body of Christ by virtue of the placing it there by the Holy Spirit, as Paul makes it so plain. And then as members of the Body of Christ, we all maintain our individuality, we all have unique place in that Body, and yet we are all what? ONE.

Galatians 3:26
"For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus."
When Paul speaks of faith in Christ he's speaking of that whole finished work of redemption, which is faith in His death, His shed blood, His burial, and His resurrection. Paul stresses constantly the power of His resurrection.

Galatians 3:27
"For as many of you as have been baptized into (your denomination?) Christ have put on Christ."
Well that's the way most people read it, isn't it? You ask the average individual, how did you become a member of your Church? Well I was baptized into it! But you see that's not what the Scriptures says. Here it says, "that you have been baptized into Christ." Now there's not a drop of water in this verse. It's as dry as a bone, and to follow up with another verse come back to Romans chapter 6, and you have the same thing.

There is no water in Romans chapter 6. Here it's basically the same thing as what Paul is saying in Galatians chapter 3.

Romans 6:3
"Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into (not into a denomination or church, but rather into) Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?"

If you've been placed in Christ then before you can get there you had to be identified with His death. And how have I always put it? When Christ died, God saw every one of us on the Cross in the Person of Christ, because He died in our place, and this is what God saw. He saw you and I crucified and that's what He means in Galatians 2 when Paul says -

Galatians 2:20
"I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me;..."

Now just as surely as God saw us on the Cross in the person of Christ, He also saw us in the tomb. So here we are in the tomb, we're buried with Him. Not by water but by virtue of God determining that now since He's paid the sin debt for all that believe, and appropriate it then yes God said, "You're dead, you're crucified, I saw you in Christ, I saw you buried with Him in his death, in His tomb, and so also we've been resurrected with Him to a new life. We are totally different people as a result of this power of His resurrection, and so it's a God thing. God in His Omnipotence, in His power, in His Omniscience, in His ability to work in the area of the invisible, He has placed us in all of these places.

In the area of the invisible He has seen everyone of us crucified with Christ. In the area of the invisible He saw everyone of us in the tomb with Christ, and in the area of the invisible He has resurrected everyone of us to a new life.

You can baptize this old body a hundred times and it's not going to change the soul and spirit. Remember this is only an outer tabernacle, but only God can work in the area of the soul and spirit.

Romans 6:3
"Know ye not, that so many of us is were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized (or identified) into his death

Romans 6:8
"Now if we be dead with Christ, (in other words if we've been crucified with Him, if we've been buried with Him then) we believe that we shall also live with him:"

How are we going to live with Him? By His resurrection power. Do you see that? We've been raised in resurrection power. We're a new person, we're a whole new being, and now we are placed into Christ.

Also keep in mind that Paul tells us in Ephesians now in this age of Grace that there is only one baptism and then I Corinthians tells us what baptism that is.

Ephesians 4:4-5
"There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; 5. One Lord, one faith, one baptism,"

I Corinthians 12:13
"For by one Spirit (the Holy Spirit, it's capitalized) are we all (believers of Paul's Gospel for salvation) baptized into one body, (the Body of Christ. Now here's another verse that is as dry as a bone. There is not a drop of water in this verse. It's the work of the Holy Spirit working in the area of the invisible placing you and I now in that new resurrected personage into that relationship with Christ.) whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and we have been all made to drink into one Spirit."

There is no color line in the Body of Christ, we believers are all baptized into that Body of Christ, and we are all one in Christ.

Now this is what comes alone from the writings of the apostle Paul. This isn't taught in the Four Gospels, this isn't taught in the Old Testament, but Paul is constantly at it. When we have faith in the Gospel then we become a member of the Body of Christ. So if you have been baptized by that Holy Spirit's work into the Body of Christ, then something else has happened. What? You have put on Christ.

Galatians 3:27
"For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ."

Romans 1:16
"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek."
He didn't say, "To everyone who repents and is baptized" or "to everyone who does according to man's traditions," but he said "to everyone that believeth"! He stated very plainly that if we believe this Gospel with all our hearts - that Christ died, was buried, and rose from the dead - then that Gospel becomes the very power of God Himself. The very power that created the universe is released on us, to us and in us so that we, by that power of God, become children of God. It is beyond human understanding, so we must take it by faith. The Bible says that is what the Gospel is, and when we believe it, God counts it as righteousness for us. But it is imperative that we be very careful what we believe!

[LBR]

Simply put, baptism is a command. Not a request, not a tradition, not an option to choose or reject. I don't understand why folks will go to great lengths to "explain" that, with this one simple term, God doesn't really mean just what He says--over and over and over again.

Is there anything special about getting dunked? Nope, no more than there is anything special about singing, speaking, eating a cracker and drinking grape juice, etc. etc. etc. However, when any of these are done according to scripture they become special. Just like the example of Naaman. Dipping in that nasty river would have done nothing, if Naaman had just decided to do it of his own accord. However, he did it according to God's command, and therefore was cleansed. The walls of Jericho didn't fall because of marching and shouting, they fell because of obedience to God's command.

Peter is quite plain in I Peter 3:21. It's not physically washing away the filth of the flesh, it's simply an act of obedience. No more and no less than physically and conciously hearing, believing, repenting, confessing, praying, singing, etc.

It boils down to a simple question, and a simple answer. Can one be saved without being obedient to God's commands? No. Nobody can explain that one away.

Chad

[Snooky]

I don't understand why folks will go to great lengths to "explain" that, with this one simple term, God doesn't really mean just what He says--over and over and over again.


Chad; When you find the answer, please let the rest of us in on the secret.


It boils down to a simple question, and a simple answer. Can one be saved without being obedient to God's commands? No. Nobody can explain that one away.


It has always cane down to these two groups of people:
1. The willing and obedient.
2. The rebellious and disobedient.

[SFC Retired]

Originally Posted by LBR

Simply put, baptism is a command. Not a request, not a tradition, not an option to choose or reject. I don't understand why folks will go to great lengths to "explain" that, with this one simple term, God doesn't really mean just what He says--over and over and over again.

Is there anything special about getting dunked? Nope, no more than there is anything special about singing, speaking, eating a cracker and drinking grape juice, etc. etc. etc. However, when any of these are done according to scripture they become special. Just like the example of Naaman. Dipping in that nasty river would have done nothing, if Naaman had just decided to do it of his own accord. However, he did it according to God's command, and therefore was cleansed. The walls of Jericho didn't fall because of marching and shouting, they fell because of obedience to God's command.

Peter is quite plain in I Peter 3:21. It's not physically washing away the filth of the flesh, it's simply an act of obedience. No more and no less than physically and conciously hearing, believing, repenting, confessing, praying, singing, etc.

It boils down to a simple question, and a simple answer. Can one be saved without being obedient to God's commands? No. Nobody can explain that one away.

Chad

It is really quite simple. Yes baptism was a requirement during the time the Gospel of the Kingdom was preached by John the Baptist, Jesus and the 12.

But not a requirement for salvation during this age of the Gospel of Grace.

Lets look and see what the book says: Paul is writing to the Corinthians because there was division in the church. Some were wanting to go by what Paul preached, some what Apollos preached, some what Peter preached and some what Christ preached.

1 Cor 1:12 Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.

If you are using a King James Bible, notice the reference to Act 18:24

Acts 18: 24-27

"And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, [and] mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.

This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto [them], and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly

And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:

So Aquila and Priscilla took him aside and explained to him the Gospel of Grace.

And where did Aquila and Priscilla get it? From the apostle Paul, who got it from the Lord. Paul worked with them as tentmakes back earlier in the book of Acts. So you know that Paul had to tell them about the Gospel of Grace.

One has to separate the Gospel of the Kingdom and the Gospel of Grace, to rightly divide the word. If you don't it will give you heartburn.

[SFC Retired]

Originally Posted by Snooky

I don't understand why folks will go to great lengths to "explain" that, with this one simple term, God doesn't really mean just what He says--over and over and over again.


Chad; When you find the answer, please let the rest of us in on the secret.


It boils down to a simple question, and a simple answer. Can one be saved without being obedient to God's commands? No. Nobody can explain that one away.


It has always cane down to these two groups of people:
1. The willing and obedient.
2. The rebellious and disobedient.

See reply above. Just read the bood and rightly divide the word.

[LBR]

Maybe I'm slow, but your post doesn't really make any sense to me. It's vague and without direct scriptural referance, very much like the post about why "baptism" doesn't mean just what it says, but every other word in those verses mean just what they say.

I don't recall Christ saying anything about a "Gospel of the Kingdom", and a separate "Gospel of Grace". I do, however, recall seeing the command to be baptized mentioned over and over and over again, even in what we refer to as the "Great Commission" in Matthew 28:19--Christ's final command to His apostles while on earth.

Appolos knew only the baptism of John, therefore he had to be taken aside and corrected. He believed wholeheartedly, but believe alone won't save anyone. James 2 expounds upon that subject in great detail, specifically in verse 19.

I believe the plan of salvation is so simple that it doesn't require any kind of special revelations or gifts to understand. A lot of folks, including myself, would be in a lot of trouble if it weren't just that simple.

Chad

[Kosherboy]

It Boils down to Christ The Messiah, God in the flesh VS Paul a Preacher and teacher, like Darby, Scotfield or any other Bible teacher we know.
In Whom should I place My Faith ? Whose instruction should I follow, In whom should I put my eyes ?

[SFC Retired]

Originally Posted by LBR

Maybe I'm slow, but your post doesn't really make any sense to me. It's vague and without direct scriptural referance, very much like the post about why "baptism" doesn't mean just what it says, but every other word in those verses mean just what they say.

I don't recall Christ saying anything about a "Gospel of the Kingdom", and a separate "Gospel of Grace". I do, however, recall seeing the command to be baptized mentioned over and over and over again, even in what we refer to as the "Great Commission" in Matthew 28:19--Christ's final command to His apostles while on earth.

Appolos knew only the baptism of John, therefore he had to be taken aside and corrected. He believed wholeheartedly, but believe alone won't save anyone. James 2 expounds upon that subject in great detail, specifically in verse 19.

I believe the plan of salvation is so simple that it doesn't require any kind of special revelations or gifts to understand. A lot of folks, including myself, would be in a lot of trouble if it weren't just that simple.

Chad

It is that simple. People made it hard.

Look at Acts 2:38. Here Peter is telling the Nation of Israel they have crucified the promised Messiah.

What does he tell them they have to do?

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Notice the orders of things. They had to repent, be baptized and then they would recieve the Holy Ghost.

Now lets look at Peter when he went to the house of Cornelius.

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

Acts 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Notice the order of things here. They recieved the Holy Ghost, but had not been baptized yet.

Yes, Peter wanted them baptized after the fact, because that is all he knew.

Why do you think there is a different order of things? God was showing Peter that salvation was coming to the gentiles. Also, God knew in his own mind the program would change because Israel had rejected Christ as the Messiah.

Again, all the nation of Israel had to believe was who Christ was. The promised Messiah.

Is this all we have to believe for our salvation? No.

We have to believe the promised Messiah died for our sins, was buried and raised again the third day.

How could Jesus taught that salvation was based on his death, burial and resurrection, when he had not died yet.

I hope this helps explain things.

[LBR]

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words,...

Peter had not finished giving the message, but the Holy Spirit came down upon Cornelius. How could that be, when it's obvious that he (Cornelius) was still ignorant of the Gospel? How could he be saved by something he didn't yet know or understand?

As you said, Cornelius was used as an example to show that Gentiles could also be saved--verse 45. It does not say that Cornelius was saved at this point.

Peter didn't "want" them to be baptized after that, he COMMANDED it. Big difference.

There are several things that are pointed out that show this was a special instance, for a special purpose. The Holy Spirit visably decended on them--in an audience of people who obviously didn't believe that this could happen to Gentiles. They also spoke in tongues (verse 46) as further evidence. Have you seen any of this happen? If not, why not, if that is an example of how we are saved today?

There is not even one Biblical example that says anyone was first saved, then baptized. In each and every example we are given, the same order is followed--Hear, Believe, Repent, Baptism, Salvation. One must add to the Word to get any other results--whether it be the house of Cornelius, the Ethiopian eunich, the Corinthian jailer, etc. The theif on the cross is also brought up in these discussions, but that is not an example. The theif died under the Law, not under Grace.

Again, taken just for what it says, there are numerous passages that emphasize the requirement of scriptural baptism to get into Christ, to get into His death, to contact His blood, to be saved, etc. etc. etc. The only way to deny this is to change, omit, or add to the Word.

Chad