Will the Body of Christ go through the Tribulation?
In Matthew 24:3, the disciples asked about signs of the end. Jesus' direct answer in verse four was, let no man deceive you. Or, in other words, one of the signs is deception or confusion.
Now, Matthew 24 is totally tribulation ground, but the world has to be prepared for even that. So, even though we are not seeing the super-natural events of the tribulation which are truly prophesied (i.e. the 2 witnesses of Revelation 11), common sense tells us the world cannot be made ready for the appearance of the Anti-christ and the False Prophet over night.
So, we are naturally witnessing all the preparations. I have often likened it to getting the stage ready before the curtain goes up. Therefore, when Jesus warned of deceivers, it follows that we can see that happen before the tribulation begins.
One of the many deceptions cascading on the Christian community like an avalanche, is the claim that the Body of Christ will go into or even through the tribulation.
The one cord that binds all these deceivers together is the rejection of Paul's Apostleship. For Paul alone reveals the Doctrines, Practices and the end of the Body on earth. For example, Paul alone reveals a salvation based on faith and faith alone in the finished work of the Cross. How Christ died for the sins of the whole world. How that His shed Blood and our faith in it brings justification. How the Power of His resurrection is imparted to us when we believe. Paul alone gives instruction for the Communion service, Paul alone gives instructions concerning Deacons (no one else uses the term) and alone gave instructions for the local church. So, also, Paul alone teaches us the end of the Body of Christ on earth. Consequently, Paul alone gives us the Scriptures concerning what many now ridicule - the rapture or the catching up of the Church which is His Body. The language of I Corinthians 15:51-54, I Thessalonians 4:13-18, II Thessalonians 2:1-3 can not be found anywhere else in our Bible.
Most who believe the Body of Christ will go through the tribulation mixes these verses with all other verses that apply only to the Second Coming when Christ will stand on the Mount of Olives.
If you mix Paul's doctrine concerning the rapture of the Church with the Second Coming, then you can mix law and Grace. And, when you mix law and Grace, Satan smiles and God is grieved.
In II Timothy, Paul paints a vivid picture of America today. But, in Titus 2:13, he gives us the Blessed Hope of the believer - the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ. I have to believe we are getting close. I trust none of you will be "left behind."
The new testament is full of warnings that we will have to go through tribulation and persecution in this life. While this cannot be used to prove that we will go through 'The Great Tribulation' we should at least note that God does not promise to prevent us going through troubles and persecution. Rather we are to endure to the end (Mat 10:22) and he promises us great reward in the next life if we are persecuted (Mat 5:12). Jesus warns his disciples that in the world they will have trouble.
(John 16:33 NIV) "I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble (thlipsis). But take heart! I have overcome the world."
Paul and Barnabas warned the new converts that they must go through many hardships
(Acts 14:22 NIV) strengthening the disciples and encouraging them to remain true to the faith. "We must go through many hardships (thlipsis ) to enter the kingdom of God," they said.
The New Testament attitude to suffering is somewhat different to ours
(Rom 5:3 NIV) Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings (thlipsis), because we know that suffering produces perseverance;
(Rom 8:35-37 NIV) Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble (thlipsis) or hardship or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword? {36} As it is written: "For your sake we face death all day long; we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered." {37} No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us.
(Rom 12:12 NIV) Be joyful in hope, patient in affliction (thlipsis), faithful in prayer.
(2 Cor 4:17 NIV) For our light and momentary troubles (thlipsis) are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all.
Suffering (thlipsis) in Revelation:
There are many examples of suffering and persecution of Christians in the book of Revelation.
The Apostle John:
(Rev 1:9 NIV) I, John, your brother and companion in the suffering (thlipsis) and kingdom and patient endurance that are ours in Jesus, was on the island of Patmos because of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus.
The church in Smyrna
(Rev 2:9-10 NIV) I know your afflictions (thlipsis) and your poverty--yet you are rich! I know the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. {10} Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution (thlipsis) for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown of life.
Those in the church at Thyatira who commit adultery with Jezebel
(Rev 2:22 NIV) So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer (thlipsis) intensely, unless they repent of her ways.
The great tribulation
(Rev 7:14 NIV) I answered, "Sir, you know." And he said, "These are they who have come out of the great tribulation (thlipsis); they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Patient endurance (hupomone) while under persecution in Revelation
The bible clearly teaches that we need the quality of endurance or perseverance while under persecution. Unless we have this we will quickly fall away as the parable of the sower warns.
John on Patmos
(Rev 1:9 NIV) I, John, your brother and companion in the suffering and kingdom and patient endurance (hupomone) that are ours in Jesus, was on the island of Patmos because of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus.
The church in Ephesus
(Rev 2:2-3 NIV) I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance (hupomone). I know that you cannot tolerate wicked men, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. {3} You have persevered (hupomone) and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary.
The church in Thyatira
(Rev 2:19 NIV) I know your deeds, your love and faith, your service and perseverance (hupomone), and that you are now doing more than you did at first.
The church in Philadelphia
(Rev 3:10 NIV) Since you have kept my command to endure patiently (hupomone), I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth.
During the reign of the beast
(Rev 13:10 NIV) If anyone is to go into captivity, into captivity he will go. If anyone is to be killed with the sword, with the sword he will be killed. This calls for patient endurance (hupomone) and faithfulness on the part of the saints.
Those who refuse to worship the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the hand (they get killed by the beast out of the earth Rev 13:15). The price for remaining faithful to Jesus is death and its reward is eternal life.
(Rev 14:12 NIV) This calls for patient endurance (hupomone) on the part of the saints who obey God's commandments and remain faithful to Jesus.
Some arguments used why the church will not go through the great tribulation.
Wrath or tribulation?
Some argue that since we will not go through wrath then we will not go through the tribulation. In the tribulation of Mat 24 which occurred in AD 70 most Christians had already left Jerusalem because of persecution by the Jews (Acts 8:1) and any remaining Christian were warned to flee when they saw Jerusalem surrounded by armies (Luke 21:20-21). The bible consistently teaches that the church (or saints) will not suffer God's wrath but will suffer tribulation. A study of the word wrath (orge) indicates that it usually refers to the day of God's wrath (Rom 2:5, Rev 6:17). The day of God's wrath will occur when Jesus comes again (see 1 Thess 1:10, 5:1-11). There is little evidence that the saints in Revelation will go through God's wrath, but they will suffer under man's or Satan's wrath.
(1 Th 5:9 NIV) For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.
When Jesus comes again we will be rescued from God's wrath which will be poured out on the ungodly instead.
(1 Th 1:10 NIV) and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead--Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath.
(Rev 11:18 NIV) The nations were angry; and your wrath has come. The time has come for judging the dead, and for rewarding your servants the prophets and your saints and those who reverence your name, both small and great-- and for destroying those who destroy the earth."
. The seven bowls of God's wrath
(Rev 15:1 NIV) I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues--last, because with them God's wrath is completed.
In 15:2 we find those who had been victorious over the beast and his image and over the number of his name.
(Rev 16:1 NIV) Then I heard a loud voice from the temple saying to the seven angels, "Go, pour out the seven bowls of God's wrath on the earth."
This bowl only affects the people who had the mark of the beast and worshiped his image (16:2).
Significantly after the sixth bowl Christ gives a warning about coming like a thief
(Rev 16:15 NIV) "Behold, I come like a thief! Blessed is he who stays awake and keeps his clothes with him, so that he may not go naked and be shamefully exposed."
At the seventh bowl God remembered Babylon
(Rev 16:19 NIV) The great city split into three parts, and the cities of the nations collapsed. God remembered Babylon the Great and gave her the cup filled with the wine of the fury of his wrath.
At the second coming
(Rev 19:11-15 NIV) I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. {12} His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. {13} He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. {14} The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. {15} Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. "He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty.
Since he comes with his saints (the armies of heaven 17:14) they are clearly not affected by the wrath of God at the Second Coming.
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The great day of the LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly. Zephaniah 1:14
פרץ
So you think the Body of Christ (believers)will go throught the tribulation?
Research The Time of Jacob's trouble.
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The great day of the LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly. Zephaniah 1:14
פרץ
Your idea of the Church and Gods is two different entities! Here is a writting about your church! Yes this is the tribulation and sorry K.B but the Jerusalem it talks contains both Jews and Gentiles. Isa 28:15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: The sinners church have made the covenant with death and Hell. They think that when the tribulation comes they will be taken away or not affected because they trust in the lie that you are saved by the sinners grace. They live in self justified sin and use the Lords name as a license for immorality. Grace definately is a major part of our salvation but not their grace. Isa 28:16¶Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner [stone], a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste. Isa 28:17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place. God has laid a precious corner stone. He that believeth the corner stone.
He that takes to heart his words and commands will not make haste.When judgment comes you will be layed to the line. You will have to line up with Jesus. How did Jesus line up. He was made perfect! You will have to be righteous to make it! If you have believed the lies of this worlds religion and doctrine you will be swept away. Isa 28:18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it. The sinful church will be here when the tribulation starts but many will not make it out alive. Spiritually or in the flesh.
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Elm River Hunt Club
Wayne County Illinois
www.illinoisdeerhunters.com
Your idea of the Church and Gods is two different entities! Here is a writting about your church! Yes this is the tribulation and sorry K.B but the Jerusalem it talks contains both Jews and Gentiles. Isa 28:15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: The sinners church have made the covenant with death and Hell. They think that when the tribulation comes they will be taken away or not affected because they trust in the lie that you are saved by the sinners grace. They live in self justified sin and use the Lords name as a license for immorality. Grace definately is a major part of our salvation but not their grace. Isa 28:16¶Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner [stone], a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste. Isa 28:17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place. God has laid a precious corner stone. He that believeth the corner stone.
He that takes to heart his words and commands will not make haste.When judgment comes you will be layed to the line. You will have to line up with Jesus. How did Jesus line up. He was made perfect! You will have to be righteous to make it! If you have believed the lies of this worlds religion and doctrine you will be swept away. Isa 28:18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it. The sinful church will be here when the tribulation starts but many will not make it out alive. Spiritually or in the flesh.
Sarge, It is appearent that you don't understand the difference between the tribulation of the anti-christ against the church, and the wrath of God upon the seat of the beast.
quote;
The one cord that binds all these deceivers together is the rejection of Paul's Apostleship. For Paul alone reveals the Doctrines, Practices and the end of the Body on earth.
I hate to burst your bubble, but Paul was a little late coming on the scene, and was called an Apostle, not a Prophet. The end of the body on earth was prophecied by Enoch, the 7th from Adam and contempory with Adam for about 300 years. Daniel prophecied of the end of the body on earth during the 70 years of captivity, much more clearly than any other. John the revelator covered the end of the body on earth in much greater depth that anything Paul wrote. Paul understood his calling and ministered according unto the gift of grace given him.
Placing more importance on what Paul said, than upon what Jesus said is very dangerous indeed.
Sarge, It is appearent that you don't understand the difference between the tribulation of the anti-christ against the church, and the wrath of God upon the seat of the beast.
quote;
The one cord that binds all these deceivers together is the rejection of Paul's Apostleship. For Paul alone reveals the Doctrines, Practices and the end of the Body on earth.
I hate to burst your bubble, but Paul was a little late coming on the scene, and was called an Apostle, not a Prophet. I did not say Paul was a Phophet. The end of the body on earth not the body of Christ was prophecied by Enoch, the 7th from Adam and contempory with Adam for about 300 years. Daniel prophecied of the end of the body on earth during the 70 years of captivity, much more clearly than any other. John the revelator covered the end of the body on earth in much greater depth that anything Paul wrote. All of the old testament prophecies was dealing with the nation of Israel and under the kingdom economy. Paul understood his calling and ministered according unto the gift of grace given him. by the ascended Lord himself.
Placing more importance on what Paul said, than upon what Jesus said is very dangerous indeed.
Well, Mr Snooky, from whom did Paul get his teaching from? The Lord himself!
Will the Body of Christ go through the Tribulation?
