What is Calvin doctrine all about??

[Chuck7]

I know very little about this subject..I know Dabowhunter is problay an expert..I do request for mnimal copy and paste and some good ole down to earth explaining for us slow learners..[8D]

What I beleive it is ..
Is a famous theologian{John Calvin}which doctrines Baptist and Presbyterians ahere to.

The most important of these doctriens are

Elect..whichneeds to be clarified ..
..Basically..there are only certain that will really ever be saved..Since you don't know who they are you preach to all creatures..

Eternal Security...The elect can not lose their salvation period..no matter what.."No man can pluck them out of the Father's hand.".

Before you replyto these statements..they need to be checked and corrected by someone who understands the doctrine more clearly. I could be wrong.

[Snooky]

Chuck: Whats up here? I seem to recall you had quite a discussion and even some phone calls with Bill, dapoppy, onthemend, ect. about this and jumped on his bandwagon declaring how much love you felt from him. Even embraceing the doctrine and declaring to us the new found peace it had brought into your live now that you didn't have to worry about being lost, ect. Am I mistaken?
I don't understand the statement that you know little about the doctrine.

[Rebel Hog]

2Thes 2:13,17
[13] But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

[17] Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work.

1Pete 1:2

[2] Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

WE BECOME GOD'S "ELECT" THROUGH THE SANCTIFYING WORK OF THE SPIRIT

[dabowhunter]

"If it be of grace, then it is no more of works otherwise grace were no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more of grace, otherwise work is no more work."

Calvinism or as some call it ...The Five Points of Calvinism. The five basic principles best know as the TULIP theory acrynom.

Total depravity
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement
Irressitible Grace
Perseverance of the saints.

I believe we generaly end up including at least one or two of these in our discussions regulary, but don't really think of it in these terms. Some Baptists will say ...Well I am a three point calvinist or fourt point or another will say they are a five point calvinist. In one of the other current posts I mention at least one peculiarity b/t Baptists and calvinism ( or at least what I as a Baptist believe). At any rate while there are certainly volumes of books written on the subject, the best source is of course the Bible. When reading the bible it is hard to get far without reading of Gods Soverign plan of Election for his saints. Really no need to look any where else but to the gospel . While we can discuss this at lenght I will say this....The doctrine of Election (or calvinism if you must) is without a doubt one of the most hated doctrines. The reason for this is IMHO is partly d/t not understanding it completly. The biggest argument usually centers on it relieving man of his responsiblities and somehow giving him a "free pass" or "license to sin" or "makes him a robot". We can study this and look at both sides of the argument if you all like. You know I would often listen to folks who scoffed at Election and denied that God would interfere with their "Free Will". Than a short time later listen to them pray for God to Save a lost loved one (right after they tied Gods hands.).

[Chuck7]

Thank you Don and Reb..for your replies..I do remember the tulip in college..it was only covered briefly. I'm at school adn will discuss more later..my son got approved ot buy our home so the house thing is going on as well..I walk through with the inspectors tonight.That was very helpful Don..you covered it very plain for us slow guys..appreciate it.We can break each point down as well.
C ya tonight.

C7

[Venator1]

I know Dabowhunter is problay an expert.

Good choice, Calvinist are for the most part well versed and intellectual when it comes to faith. Another words you had better have it together if you plan on debating.I grew up in Reformed Church and most new exactly what was going on. Far better than a schmuck like myself

[Kosherboy]

Instead of being a calvanist I chose Christ. IMO

[Turkey Fife]

Instead of being a calvanist I chose Christ.

KB you never cease to amaze me. Where do you Worship? Are you a Christian?

I get the feeling you don't care for meReason is you very seldom respond to my Posts.

I have never ment to Offend you in any way shape or form.

TF

[dabowhunter]

James 1:17 says, "Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights...." Every blessing, whether physical or spiritual in nature, comes "from above," from the hand of a Sovereign God. Regeneration is no exception. Salvation, in all of itsparts, is the work of God. He is active. Man is the passive recipient.

Only God can regenerate.
"God...hath saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began" (2 Tim. 1:9).

In unmistakable language, Paul argues that God's gracious purpose, not man's works, is the source of salvation. 2 Timothy 1:9 is Paul's version of Psalm 100:3,
"It is He that bath made us and not we ourselves."

In the prologue to his gospel, John traces the origin of regeneration to God:
"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God" (Jno. 1:12--13).

The new birth is not the product of human lineage ("not of blood"), nor is it the result of a human relationship ("nor of the will of the flesh"), nor the result of a human decision ("nor of the will of man.") Man's will is not instrumental in his new birth. Man is born "of God" the preposition "of" denotes the source or origin. People are not born again as a result of something they do, but solely on the basis of God's sovereign will and power. While the scriptures readily attest to this man only sees himself as the generator of his salvation because God brings the lost sinner who is spritually dead to life and removes the scales that were blinding him. Than when he is already regenerated by the holy spirit he is able to recognize and accept salvation. Even though God drew him and regenerated the man who was dead in his sins, he only is perceptive of his own words and actions, this assuming he did it all by himself.

btw. as way of a disclaimer... I am no expert. I only know what I do from frequent study. (and usually forget most of what I learn, than have to relearn it)

[DaveH]

Some Baptists will say ...Well I am a three point calvinist or fourt point

I'm one of them! I was a member of one church for 20 something years - met my wife there and the pastor led me to the Lord and I led him to bowhunting. We were great hunting buddies and friends. The church eventually split when he (and the assistant pastors) all announced that they had come to believe in limited atonement. The church constitution disagreed with this point and wouldn't allow a pastor there who disagreed. He and the other pastors started a reformed Baptist church and half the members (including many of my closest friends) began attending there. My wife and I left both churches and tried several others before attending where we've been for 15 or so years.

I say all that to say this. I'd never even heard of limited atonement before it split that church. When I looked at it and saw that it claims that Christ died ONLY for those who accepted Him, I saw the obvious conflict with scripture and decided no to go where my hunting buddies and friends had gone. I didn't stay at the other chruch either because I didn't like that way they went about doing what they did.

IMO, limited atonement is not supported by scripture and I can't go along with that teaching.