Problems With The KJV Translation ?

[Kosherboy]

When the King James Version (KJV) was translated in 1611, errors in the version of the Greek New Testament text that was used by the KJV translators resulted in errors in the KJV text. Listed below are some of the modifications needed to help make the KJV agree with the original texts of the New Testament. These modifications are not simply alternatives to the wording used by the KJV translators; rather, they represent actual corrections to the Greek texts (the so-called Textus Receptus) from which the KJV was translated. (These corrections are already reflected in the New Revised Standard Version, the Today's English Version, and most other modern translations.)
The texts now comprising the New Testament were first written in Greek, somewhere between the middle of the first century A.D. and the middle of the second century A.D. (Many scholars believe that 1 Thessalonians was the first book written, around 49 or 50 A.D., and that 2 Peter was the last New Testament book to be written, sometime between 110 and 140 A.D.) All of the texts were hand-copied from the first century up to 1516, when the first printed New Testament Greek text was published. The Greek New Testament text used by the KJV translators was mostly based upon incomplete, twelfth-century copies of earlier Greek texts. These twelfth-century copies themselves had been hand-copied from many generations of earlier copies. For more details on the history of the transmission of these texts and for more details on their influence on the KJV, browse http://www.bibletexts.com/kjv-tr.htm.
Those corrections below comprise only a partial listing. Additions to this list will be made as time is able to be devoted to further comparing and contrasting the texts of Stephanus' 1550 Greek New Testament text (generally consistent with the Textus Receptus) and the United Bible Societies' 1993 The Greek New Testament, Fourth Revised Edition.
For a more comprehensive listing of King James Version verses that require corrections to the underlying Hebrew and Greek text, browse the commentaries on each individual book of the Bible at http://www.bibletexts.com/bt.htm.

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The following comprises a very small sampling of words, phrases, and verses that were not in the original Greek texts of the New Testament:
[ul][*]Mat 5:22 - without a cause[*]Mat 6:4,6,18 - openly[*]Mat 6:13 - For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen. (Please note the following
[ul][*]In the Textual Commentary of the Greek New Testament, Second Edition (NY: United Bible Societies, 1994, page 13-14), Bruce Metzger writes, "The ascription ["a form of prayer ascribing praise to God spoken by a minister, usually after a sermon" (Webster's Third)] at the close of the Lord's Prayer occurs in several forms... The absence of any ascription in early and important [ancient manuscripts], as well as early patristic commentaries on the Lord's Prayer... suggests that an ascription, usuallly in a threefold form, was composed (perhaps on the basis of 1 Chr 29:11-13) in order to adapt the Prayer for liturgical use in the early church." [/ul][*]Mat 12:35 - of the heart[*]Mat 17:21 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mat 18:11 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mat 19:29 - or wife[*]Mat 23:14 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mat 27:35 - that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots.[*]Mar 7:16 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mar 7:24 - and Sidon[*]Mar 8:26 - nor tell it to any in the town.[*]Mar 9:23 - believe[*]Mar 9:29 - and fasting[*]Mar 9:44 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mar 9:46 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mar 10:21 - take up the cross[*]Mar 10:24 - for them that trust in riches[*]Mar 10:29 - or wife[*]Mar 11:26 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mar 13:33 - and pray[*]Mar 15:28 - (omit entire verse)[*]Mar 16:9-20 - (please note the following
[ul][*]Bruce Metzger (ibid., page 105-106) writes, "On the basis of good external evidence and strong internal considerations it appears that the earliest ascertainable form of the Gospel of Mark ended with 16.8. At the same time, however, out of deference to the evident antiquity of the longer ending and its importance in the textual tradition of the Gospel, the Committee [the Editorial Committee of the United Bible Societies' Greek New Testament, of which Dr. Metzger is a member] decided to include verses 9-20 as part of the text, but to enclose them within double square brackets in order to indicate that they are the work of an author other than the evangelist." [/ul][*]Luk 1:28 - blessed art thou among women[*]Luk 5:17 - them[*]Luk 7:28 - prophet[*]Luk 8:45 - and all they that were with him[*]Luk 9:54 - even as Elijah did[*]Luk 9:55-56 - and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them.[*]Luk 11:11 - ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he [*]Luk 17:3 - against thee[*]Luk 17:36 - (omit entire verse)[*]Luk 22:68 - nor let me go[*]Luk 23:17 - (omit entire verse)[*]Luk 24:42 - and of a honeycomb[*]Joh 3:13 - which is in heaven[*]Joh 3:34 - unto him[*]Joh 4:24 - a[*]Joh 5:3 - waiting for the moving of the water [*]Joh 5:4 - (omit entire verse)[*]Joh 6:47 - on me[*]Joh 7:53-8:11 - (please note the following
[ul][*]Bruce Metzger (ibid., page 187-189) writes that there is overwhelming and conclusive evidence that the text from John 7:53 to John 8:11 was not part of the original text of John. It was absent from important early and diverse New Testament manuscripts. He writes, "At the same time the account has all the earmarks of historical veracity. It is obviously a piece of oral tradition which circulated in certain parts of the Western church and which was subsequently incorporated into various manuscripts at various places... Although the Committee was unanimous that [this passage] was originally no part of the Fourth Gospel, in deference to the evident antiquity of the passage a majority decided to print it, enclosed within double square brackets, at its traditional place following Jn. 7.52." [/ul][*]Act 5:32 - his[*]Act 8:37 - (omit entire verse)[*]Act 9:5 - it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks[*]Act 9:6 - And he trembling and astonished, said, Lord what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him,[*]Act 15:34 - (omit entire verse)[*]Act 20:15 - and tarried at Trogyllium[*]Act 22:9 - and were afraid[*]Act 23:30 - Farewell.[*]Act 24:6-8 - and would have judged according to our law. But the chief captain Sysias came upon us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands, commanding his accusers to come unto thee:[*]Act 28:29 - (omit entire verse)[*]Rom 3:22 - and upon all[*]Rom 8:1 - who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit[*]Rom 11:6 - But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.[*]Rom 14:9 - and rose[*]Rom 14:21 - or is offended, or is made weak[*]Rom 16:24 - (omit entire verse)[*]1Co 6:20 - and in your spirit, which are God's[*]1Co 7:5 - fasting and[*]1Co 10:28 - for the earth is the Lord's and the fulness therof[*]1Co 15:47 - the Lord[*]Gal 2:6 - in conference[*]Gal 5:21 - murders[*]Eph 5:30 - of his flesh, and of his bones[*]Col 1:2 - and the Lord Jesus Christ[*]Col 2:2 - and of the Father, and[*]2Th 2:4 - as God[*]Heb 3:6 - firm unto the end[*]Heb 9:9 - then[*]Heb 11:13 - and were persuaded of them[*]Heb 12:20 - or thrust through with a dart[*]1Pe 4:14 - on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified[*]1Jo 5:7-8 - in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost; and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth[*]1Jo 5:13 - and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God[*]Rev 1:11 - I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, [*]Rev 2:15 - which thing I hate[*]Rev 6:1,3,5,7 - and see[*]Rev 11:1 - and the angel stood[*]Rev 14:5 - before the throne of God[*]Rev 21:24 - of them which are saved[*]Rev 22:21 - Amen. [/ul]
NOTE:When you are privately reading the King James Version, in order to more nearly read what was in the original text of the New Testament, do not read the words, phrases, and verses listed above. They are not based on the original Greek texts of the New Testament. (In my own King James Version Bibles, I have identified these words, phrases, or verses by enclosing them in square brackets, which I have written with a red pen. This enables me to easily and consistently recognize what not to read.)

[PreacherTony]

Kosherboy .... the originals do not exist anymore .... you are trying to cast doubt on the Bible that has lead the greatest revivals of all time .....

[Ought_Six]

Oddly,I find myself in agreement with Kosherboy this time. For it's time, the KJV was a wonderful translation. It is indeed still useful. But, I like the idea of using some of the information we have dug up since 1611.

[PreacherTony]

I'll stick with what has worked best for the English speaking people .... beware of the "new light" that Jw's and the like speak of ....

[Rebel Hog]

Jewish History - FAMILY FAULTS AND FEUDS

Guys, keep in mind, Alex has said he is not even sure Paul wrote the letters. He thinks its possible that someone rewrote with an agenda. So take his posts for what thier worth. Possibly with an agenda

[PreacherTony]

ORIGINAL: bigcountry

Guys, keep in mind, Alex has said he is not even sure Paul wrote the letters. He thinks its possible that someone rewrote with an agenda. So take his posts for what thier worth. Possibly with an agenda

AHHHHHH ... thanx Mark ... I did not know that .... my last post on this thread

[Leafrivermac]

I would'nt doubt that there are some traslation errors in the KJV. That said, even with the errors the gosple message is recorded loud and clear as it is. The next thing in identifying these errors for deeper or a more clear study would to be to question ourselves as to whose word or what source we are using for these clarifications.
Theres been too many folks lives illuminated, and their faith fortified, and good sound direction given to discredit the KJV. Our faith however is in God's word and message to us in it's pure form and not thru man's translation of it, nor in King James.
I have long wondered about some few things tho. I know that the apostles penned the original writings under the inspiration of the Holy Ghost, but am not convinced that the English translation is inerrant in some ways. At the very least I feel that the translaters ran into some problems when trying to determine certain aspects of their manuscripts.
Am I correct tho in remembering that the KJV was originally based off of six Greek texts? It seems that I read that we now have over five thousand manuscripts that can be used to compare with to determine original readings.
Basically, I'm going to leave this alone. I'm a KJV person myself . . .just not a KJV only person. I don't think one can go wrong with it, and I don't think there is any major new revelation to be found that can't be found in the KJV.

[Kosherboy]

ORIGINAL: bigcountry

Guys, keep in mind, Alex has said he is not even sure Paul wrote the letters. He thinks its possible that someone rewrote with an agenda. So take his posts for what thier worth. Possibly with an agenda

I said some parts of the letters fromPaul, Might not have been written by him.
Everyone knows in his last days he scribes that wrote for him.
My Agenda if any is for you to seek the truth in all manners.
That some transliterations have been altered to accomodate the catholic agendas , well that is a well known fact.
Just Look at 1 John 5 speaking of the trinity and research it.

[Kosherboy]

ORIGINAL: PreacherTony

Kosherboy .... the originals do not exist anymore .... you are trying to cast doubt on the Bible that has lead the greatest revivals of all time .....

Tony,
Modern versions of the New Testament are no longer made from Erasmus' Greek Testament of 1516. Our scientifically edited Greek Testaments of today, such as Westcott-Hort, Nesley, are based upon the earliest and most concrete evidence. Anyone who would argue that these New Testaments do not contain the original text would thereby confess his ignorance of the history of the transmission of the Bible and the science of textual criticism.
The evidence behind such a modern edition of the Greek New Testament, is threefold. First, manuscript evidence. Second, the evidence from early versions. Third, the evidence from the quotations of the Greek scriptures by the Greek fathers. Any one of these types of evidence is enough to confirm the authenticity of the original text. Therefore, they form a tripod of evidence which is overwhelming. "In the mouth of two or three witnesses, shall every word be established" II Corinthians 13:1.
A whole book could be written on each type of evidence, but it is enough to note, for example, that practically every verse of the New Testament in Greek can be recovered from quotations of the New Testament by the Greek fathers (or scholars) in their writings. Again, versions or translations of the New Testament into Syriac, Old Latin, the Egyptian dialects, etc. were made beginning from three or four decades after the completion of the canon of the New Testament. Scholars with knowledge in these languages can verify the Greek text and the way these translations read. Most important is the overwhelming evidence from the Green manuscripts, the English and American Revised Versions of 1880 and 1901 were based primarily on the great Greek manuscripts of the fourth and fifth centuries. And so abundant have been the discoveries in the past sixty-five years that we can now go nearly two hundred years farther back with the evidence. Such great textual discoveries as the papyrus manuscripts of Chester Batey; the Bodlar manuscript of John and Luke, enrich our knowledge beyond the fondest dreams of textual critics of the last century, and still the sands of Egypt and the Middle East continue to yield treasures. Surely, in God's providence, such discoveries are being brought forth in the modern dark ages of doubt to light the way to faith in God's Holy Word. With such firm confidence in the original text we stand upon the fi m rock of God's immutable truth. Our Lord himself said, "Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away" (Matthew 24:35). Surely the God who made this world with all its complexities is capable of preserving his word for all generations.