Why, then, do we run into so many students (and adults) who have said the sinner's prayer and answer "yes" to polls that ask, "Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God?"--and yet their lives in no way reflect that belief?
Many of our students recently went to Cancun, Mexico, for spring break--these are kids who profess a great love for Christ, attend youth group every week, counsel younger kids at camps and retreats, and wear WWJD bracelets. Yet many of them spent the week in Mexico, binge drinking, entering wet t-shirt contests, and going back to the hotel rooms with someone they just met on the dance floor.
It should not surprise us when non-Christians act like non-Christians--they don't know Jesus, and they should not be held to the standards to which Christians are held. What is shocking is when people who doknow Jesus so brazenly act as though they don't--when that church elder shows up with a $10,000 mink coat on Sunday, when the deacon leaves his wife, or when the most solid kid you've got goes to a party and gets a girl he just met pregnant.
-Excerpt from Postmodern Youth Ministry by Tony Jones
Any thoughts or ideas or comments? Yea/nay?
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πνεύμα γ*μισα
"Error never shows itself in its naked reality in order not to be discovered. On the contrary, it dresses elegantly, so that the unwary may be led to believe that it is more truthful than truth itself."
-Irenaeus of Lyon
Froman, I think the modern christian is a product of our modern evangelistism 'tactics'. It too late and and would take a loooonnnngg post to explain exactly what I mean.
Don't know what type of replies you had in mind for this, if the above strikes any chords with you I can try to get a series of audio files to you from a guy named Ray Comfort.
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Anything I say is my opinion, just that...and only that.
"...and what does the Lord require of you, but to do justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with your God?
I'm not saying that ignorance is a license, but in some people's mind that kind of behavior (at least portions of it) simply aren't seen as unacceptable. How? I don't know, other than to guess it is from the example set before them. (Yes, Christ should be our example...not solely fellow "christians" or "church-goers") The example I'm thinking of is cursing. I have friends at school here how are good hearted, "christian" people...and although it isn't in there everyday conversational vocabulary, when something goes wrong, or they have one of those stub-your-toe experiences...the words fly. Wrong? Yes. Do they have any conviction about it? No. Do they realize that's not appropriate...I really wonder sometimes. You bring it up with them and they know "yeah yeah its in the bible somewhere" but somewhere in there minds they seperate what the bible says and what God actually expects.
It's weird and I don't get it...but see often.
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Anything I say is my opinion, just that...and only that.
"...and what does the Lord require of you, but to do justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with your God?
It is easy to be a christian.....you are always being forgiven....How easy is that?[&:]
Like the mass murderer on death row who says they feel at peace because they have found God, or those who say they should be spared.......it is easy to call your self a christian. It is much tougher to just be a decent human being. Remember the "golden rule" was said 500 years before Christ was to have walked the earth. Christians seem to enjoy stealing it and claiming it as their own.[:@]
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." Budda.
It is easy to be a christian.....you are always being forgiven....How easy is that?[&:]
Like the mass murderer on death row who says they feel at peace because they have found God, or those who say they should be spared.......it is easy to call your self a christian. It is much tougher to just be a decent human being. Remember the "golden rule" was said 500 years before Christ was to have walked the earth. Christians seem to enjoy stealing it and claiming it as their own.[:@]
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." Budda.
Exactly what you are taking about Froman... It's easy to mouth the words.. you can see what is in their heart by what comes of the mouth.. The Bible says, " Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks." Bob.<><
I'm not suprised when Christians sin and fall short. The bible tells us this will happen but though I'm not going to judge individuals I think there aremany people who claim to be Christians that really aren't. I think many profess Christianity because they grew up and live in a Christian environment. Their parents, parents friends, relatives and friends are Christian and they claim to beChristiansimply because they feel that's the right way to be and would be ostricized if they didn't at least mouth the words. There is a lot of social pressure on the young especially to conform. Unfortuantely, in their hearts they don't truly believe. It's all just an act. Once they are in an environment or social situation where they don't feel the pressure to conform to expected Christian behavior they don't. THere is nothing inside of them to prick their concience. Just my opinion.
Why, then, do we run into so many students (and adults) who have said the sinner's prayer and answer "yes" to polls that ask, "Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God?"--and yet their lives in no way reflect that belief?
Many of our students recently went to Cancun, Mexico, for spring break--these are kids who profess a great love for Christ, attend youth group every week, counsel younger kids at camps and retreats, and wear WWJD bracelets. Yet many of them spent the week in Mexico, binge drinking, entering wet t-shirt contests, and going back to the hotel rooms with someone they just met on the dance floor.
IMHO The sad fact is that they are not Christians. Show me where in the Bible you find"the sinner's prayer" it is not there. When Saul was converted he prayed for three days, and STILL had things that he "must do" in order to be saved! Read it for your self, Acts 9. James puts it well... James 2:17-18 "So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. But someone will say, "You have faith and I have works." Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works."
Goose is right on this one. Repeating the "sinners prayer" as it is called, is akin to teaching one how to "speak in tongues".
The fool saith "IN HIS HEART" there is no God. We have a lot of "head" religion, and very little heart felt salvation.
There is no easy or simple answer. The simple and easy answer is that these poeple aren't 'true' believers. Yet, we see throughout the Scriptures, examples of ture believers doing some awful things. David, a man after God's own heart, was involved in adultery and murder. Peter was prejudiced, and there were times when he and Paul didn't get along. One of the evidences of the authenticity of the Scriptures is its honesty inits portrayal of the characters involved. God doesn't hide the flaws of His people. We shouldbn't be so surprised when Christian people do wrong. We don't have to look very far to see the dynamics within ourselves. Walking in His light will expose all sorts of wrong. If not in behavior, certainly in attitude.Paul said, the good that he wants to do, he doesn't do , and the very evil that he wishes not to do , he finds himself doing. That's not th eend of the story though, because he goes on to say that we can be overcomers. Its th eovercoming part that is so involved, and avoided. It is painful and proplonged, and most of us don't want to go through the process of growth and self denial involved. We aren't prepared to ttake up our cross, and we are not prepared for the painstaking process of having our minds truly renewed. We won't be conformed, or shaped like th eworld when the transformation, bythe renewing of teh mind takes place.It doesn't happenovernight, by some miraculous, one time laying on of the hands or some other experience. It happens when we quit hiding behind our self righteous denials. We spend so much time excusing ourselves, and putting on a ashow out of fear of someone seeing our real selves that we never get beyond the pretense. Sure there is an element of teh ones that never were born again, or never truly submitted their lives to Christ infaith that accounts for some of this, but, that is just the easy way out of dealing with it.We have to get our priorities in line, and seek first the Kingdom, and that means putting our own self interest behind.It takes a deliberate and concerted effort, and the right climate for this to take place. Our churches need to acknowledge the far reaching grip that the world has, and the extent of the demonic strongholds, and to deliberately, honestly , and effectively encounter the problems. Pornography, addictions to drugs, alcohol, materialism, worldliness all exist in our ranks, --our real and genuine ranks--and as soon as we recognize it, and stop avoiding the reality and confront it, then it will be able to be overcome. The remedy is available. We have to admit we need it, and then deal with it deliberately and, doggedly confront, shift into the light, take up ou cross, submit our wils them our minds to the renewing work of the Spirit--or we can continue on with the status quo.
I believe its due to everyone forgets or never believes God's wrath. We all see his mercy, and grace, but quickly forget his wrathfulness. He gave us example in the Old Testiment. We keep thinking he will forgive us.
Why today?
