i and the father are one

cataway · 01-04-2006, 09:37 PM

THAT text, at John 10:30, is often cited to support the Trinity, even though no third person is mentioned there. But Jesus himself showed what he meant by his being "one" with the Father. At John 17:21, 22, he prayed to God that his disciples "may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us, . . . that they may be one just as we are one." Was Jesus praying that all his disciples would become a single entity? No, obviously Jesus was praying that they would be united in thought and purpose, as he and God were."”See also 1 Corinthians 1:10

The Rev · 01-04-2006, 10:41 PM

Cataway you forgot another one most people quote.

Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

cataway · 01-05-2006, 04:00 PM

well rev we don't question who the father is ,we don't question who the

son is .but what is holy spirit? and why refer to it as if it had a name.

" A "name" can mean something other than a personal name. When, in English, we

say, "in the name of the law," or "in the name of common sense," we have no

reference to a person as such. By "name" in these expressions we mean "˜what the

law stands for or its authority"™ and "˜what common sense represents or calls for."™

" Hence baptism "˜in the name of the holy spirit"™ implies recognition of that spirit as

having its source in God and as exercising its function according to the divine will.

It may first be noted that the words "in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy

Ghost: and these three are one" (KJ) found in older translations at 1 John 5:7 are

actually spurious additions to the original text. A footnote in The Jerusalem Bible, a

Catholic translation, says that these words are "not in any of the early Greek MSS

[manuscripts], or any of the early translations, or in the best MSS of the Vulg[ate] itself."

The Rev · 01-05-2006, 05:49 PM

Cataway remember the unpardable sin? Okay

Now as far as the Holy Spirit, I usually don't get into long responses because if you don't agree with me, I really don't care. I've been fighting these things for so long I don't have it in me anymore.

What would you think of a person who kept referring to your son or daughter as "IT" This would be all right before birth when the sex is not known and the child is not ifentified - but after the birth it is inexcusable-it would hurt the parents to hear their child called an IT.

The Holy Spirit is grieved when we do not recognize Him as a person (Eph 4:30)., The constant use of such expressions as:
I need more of it, or it ought to be studied more, or it is a great source of power, is indicative of lack of knowledge and ingnorance not to mention stupidity, and down right disrespectfull of the Him, the Holy Spirit of God.

He is a person:
A person has the power of speech 1st Tim 4:1
A person has the power fo decide or exercises the willthrough the mind. Acts 16: 6-7
A person has the ability to teach John 14: 26 1st Cor 2: 13
A person has the ability to testify or witness John 15:26
A peson can lead others and forbid others. Acts 16: 6-7

Howbeit when He, the Spirit of Truth, is come He shall guide you into all the the truth: for He shall not speak of Himself, but what things soever He shalll hear, these shall He speak: and He shall declare unto you the thingsthat are to come. John 16:13

If you need more, I can mail them to your house. I hate to type this much.
I know this is a sign of many cults, they deny the deityChrist, and fail to recognize the Holy Spirit.

Alex The Hawk · 01-05-2006, 06:48 PM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: cataway

well rev we don't question who the father is ,we don't question who the

son is .but what is holy spirit? and why refer to it as if it had a name.

" A "name" can mean something other than a personal name. When, in English, we

say, "in the name of the law," or "in the name of common sense," we have no

reference to a person as such. By "name" in these expressions we mean "˜what the

law stands for or its authority"™ and "˜what common sense represents or calls for."™

" Hence baptism "˜in the name of the holy spirit"™ implies recognition of that spirit as

having its source in God and as exercising its function according to the divine will.

It may first be noted that the words "in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy

Ghost: and these three are one" (KJ) found in older translations at 1 John 5:7 are

actually spurious additions to the original text. A footnote in The Jerusalem Bible, a

Catholic translation, says that these words are "not in any of the early Greek MSS

[manuscripts], or any of the early translations, or in the best MSS of the Vulg[ate] itself."

Yes He has a name it is Ha Rhua Ha Kodesh
But you won't find it in any english translation.Specially yours.

Leafrivermac · 01-05-2006, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Howbeit when He, the Spirit of Truth, is come He shall guide you into all the the truth: for He shall not speak of Himself, but what things soever He shalll hear, these shall He speak: and He shall declare unto you the things that are to come. John 16:13.I know this is a sign of many cults, they deny the deityChrist, and fail to recognize the Holy Spirit.

Thank you Rev, I struggled over a responce to this that probably would have offended. Your scripture is plain enough and more than sufficient.

The Rev · 01-05-2006, 07:14 PM

Bro Mac, you and I are not too far off our beliefs, I think if we sat down we would probably agree on 99 % and thats good enough for me... When referring to cults I mean the ones that Deny Jesus, they say He was a great prophet, but not God or from God. Brother,,, thats a cult... JW are inculded in this, sorry if I offend you Cataway, but that's how I feel.

Alex The Hawk · 01-05-2006, 07:16 PM

From the hebrew New Testament:

1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are from Elohim: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of Elohim: Every spirit that confesseth thatYeshua the Messiahis come in the flesh is of God:
3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Yeshua The Messiah is come in the flesh is not of Elohim: and this is that spirit of antimessiah, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

1 John Chapter 4

Rebel Hog · 01-05-2006, 07:18 PM

Rev., I'm alsowith you and bro.Mac!

Leafrivermac · 01-05-2006, 07:52 PM

Rev, Without even sitting down with ya I can see that we pretty well agree. As far as the JW, being a cult . . .I don't really know if they fit my definition of a "cult", but if being a cult means that they are decieved and proud of it, then I guess they are. I myself, am also not wanting to offend but am beholden to say thatI feel it is not just a little bit, . .but dead wrong.