I have not seen the "Exorcism of Emily Rose" yet but I've been watching all the Discovery Channel shows it spawned. Very interesting. It's a subject I've never really gotten into. Just wondering what your opinions on this subject are. Some of the "exorcisms" I've seen on the shows looked like they might be legit, but I have to admit (even as a believer) that most looked extremely fake or staged. There was one guy in particular who traveled around the country doing up to 20 a week! According to Time magazine, exorcisms are on a sharp rise in the U.S., and have never lost popularity (for lack of a better word) in eastern Europe. Has anyone seen these shows? What do you think? Real, Fake, Exaggerated? Or if you have any personal experience, that would be more convincing to say the least.
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While you rest, someone, somewhere, is training. When you meet, you will lose.
Good topic Brother, I am a firm beleiver in the casting out of Demons even though I have never personally seen it done, nor have I known anyone who has been possesed or cast out demons, unless of course you want to count Christ and the Apostles.
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The Tazman aka Martin Price
Proud father of a Devil Dog
You should come down to Miami to our church , we deal with Cubans who are into Santeria and Voodoo
Those exorcisms you see on TV are fake as a 3.00 bill.
Real possessions are not like that, you really have to battle satan and sometimes it takes 6 people to hold a 120 lb woman.
The santeria possessed are low grade demons and ususally flee quickly, except those into african witchcraft called palo mayumbe, those are high ranking demons and take a big battle and fasting.
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"Blessed is He who Comes in The Name of The Lord"
saw a video of a church revival that had a demon possessed women be freed. i now that it was real cause it was my aunt and uncles church, made the hair on my neck stand up.
I like to think I'm fairly educated in my religion and up to date on things. That's why this topic facinated me so much. I never knew that so many Christian Churchs practiced exorcism. I thought it was mostly a Catholic thing. When you hear of them, it's usually refering to the few famous Catholic exocisms. It made me realize that, although I hate to admit it, I was duped by hollywood. They never make movies about exorcisms unless it involves the Catholic Church. When in reality, it appears that Christian and Baptist Churchs do 10 times as many in any given year. Interesting.
Hammer, I agree with you. Makes my hair stand up too. It's like a train wreck, it's scary to think about, but I can't help but want to see and learn more about it.
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While you rest, someone, somewhere, is training. When you meet, you will lose.
Although I accept the possibility of demon possession, I believe it to be extremely rare. Like maybe 1 or 2 cases per century. I believe nearly 100% of the cases you hear about are either faked or the possessed person is actualy mentally disturbed.
Well, I firmly believe that a person can have or be oppressed by a demonic spirit. From what experiance I have had with it (which I know is limited), I view it much like we invite the Spirit of Christ into our body. What I have seen of this . .at some point these folk were dealing with spirits of the devil . . .even tho they may not have known it was of the devil, and as a consequence had an "infilling"? Most of the few folk that I felt were possessed of an evil spirit were not looking to be released from it. I use to not have enough sense to be afraid of too much, but as a young christian, I was going to witness to this fellow once that undoubtably was a keeper of a bad spirit. His actions were unnerving. I had never seen anything like it, and I was sure he was gonna do me in. I wasn't ready for that and I failed miserably.
__________________ And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
Thank you for the scriptures you all used because we know that the Word is that will judge us. (John 12:48) OH Wait! You didn't use any! Guys based on your beliefs I can only conclude that 1.) you are liers (which I hope is not true) or 2.) you are untaught on what the bible says.It is absolutely imperative that we examine Scripture"not our feelings, not what someone else says happened to them, and not our own experience. The only sure and certain approach is to ask: What does the Bible teach?You must ask: "Do I honestly believe the Bible to be the Word of God?" Answers to critical questions of human existence require that a person be willing to spend time in the Word, "rightly dividing the word of truth" (2 Timothy 2:15). One must "search the scriptures" (Acts 17:11). One must be honest and willing to go where the evidence takes him. If you had to choose between what you genuinely think you have experienced or seen firsthand and what the Bible actually says, which would you choose?
the Bible does tell us many things about demons. For example, demons are spirits (Matthew 8:16; Luke 24:39). Demons are always depicted as unclean, evil, and malevolent. They are associated with Satan"s influence (Matthew 9:34; 12:24,43,45; Luke 11:15). Demons also are shown to be conscious, intelligent entities who possess true knowledge of God and Christ. In Mark 1:24, a demon spoke to Jesus, "I know who you are"the holy one of God." Demons exercised volition and even locomotion (Matthew 12:44-45).
Demons frequently caused physical and/or mental illness. For instance, in Matthew 9:32, the victim of demon possession experienced "dumbness," i.e., the inability to talk. Such illnesses were distinguishable from the demons themselves (Matthew 4:24). Some say demons have never actually existed, and that the Bible account of demons is simply the superstitious, pre-scientific explanation of epilepsy and other physical or emotional disorders. But in the New Testament, a clear distinction is drawn between demons and the illnesses that a demon might cause. Some demons had superhuman strength (Mark 5:4; Acts 19:16). No reason is given in the New Testament for why some individuals were singled out for demon possession. Included were men (Matthew 9:32), women (Luke 8:2), and even children (Mark 7:30).
What was the purpose of demons, and what was their relationship to God? It is clear from the Bible that God had ultimate control over them. For example, in Luke 10:17, the seventy returned from their preaching tour and said to Jesus, "Lord, even the demons are subject to us through your name." A careful study of the New Testament will disclose the fact that demon possession was divinely permitted to show the supreme authority of Christ and His inspired representatives. During His earthly stay, Jesus demonstrated His power over: (1) nature and the created order (Mark 4:31); (2) disease (Mark 1:32-34); (3) physical substances (John 2:9); (4) death (John 11:44); and (5) the spirit realm and Satan (Mark 1:27). This supreme authority and manifestation of power set the stage for the establishment of His kingdom. In Luke 11:20, Jesus said: "But if I, with the finger of God, cast out demons, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you." The reader is urged to study carefully John 12:31, Ephesians 2:2 and 4:8, Colossians 2:15, Acts 10:38, Luke 10:17-20, and Matthew 12:28-29. John explained that "he who commits sin is of the devil; for the devil sins from the beginning. For this purpose, the son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil" (1 John 3:8). John"s statement correlates well with Hebrews 2:14, where the writer states: "Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil."
These passages show that when Christ effected His death, resurrection, and kingdom, Satan"s power was dealt a blow that resulted in a measure of limitation. He was restrained to the extent that direct, supernatural influence over a human being ended. Just as the ability to expeldemons has ceased (Mark 16:17; 1 Corinthians 13:8-10), so the ability of demons to possess humans has ceased. When direct miraculous ability gradually ceased as the apostolic age drew to a close, so demonic activity also ceased.
That is the Bible picture. This picture is very different from the claims being made today regarding demon possession and Satanism. In the New Testament, Jesus expelled evil spirits publicly and in the presence of multitudes (Luke 4:36). But much of the work of exorcists today is hidden and only reported second hand. The alleged exorcisms by those who are daring enough to operate publicly are contrived and unconvincing.
In the New Testament, expulsion of demons was achieved by a word with immediate results. For example, "Jesus rebuked the demon; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour" (Matthew 17:18). Read also Acts 19:12. But exorcism today is a long, drawn-out process in which multiple attempts are made. In the New Testament, demon possession caused the malfunction of otherwise normal body traits. You simply do not find in the New Testament the theatrical manifestations alleged by those who affirm demon possession occurs today"fire from the mouth, bulging eyes, transparent teeth, green slime spewing forth, and electricity emitted from fingers.
Another significant difference between demon possession in the Bible and alleged demon possession today is that in the New Testament, demons were respectful of deity and acknowledged Jesus as the "holy one of God" (Mark 1:24; 3:11). Demons knew that Jesus ultimately would banish them to torment (Matthew 8:29). They did not blaspheme deity. But claims today include curses and blasphemy directed against God.
In view of these biblical facts, what must we conclude? Demons do not possess people today. The Old Testament predicted that demon possession would cease in the first century.
[blockquote]In that day there shall be a fountain opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin and for uncleanness. And it shall come to pass in that day says the Lord of hosts that I will cut off the names of the idols out of the land and they shall no more be remembered; and also I will cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to pass out of the land (Zechariah 13:1-2).[/blockquote]
In addition, the Bible everywhere condemns those who practice spiritualism, sorcery, witchcraft, astrology, and all other forms of divination. Moses warned the Israelites as they were about to enter Canaan:
[blockquote]When you enter the land which the Lord your God gives you, you shall not learn to imitate the detestable things of those nations. There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, one who uses divination, one who practices witchcraft, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who casts a spell, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. For whoever does these things is detestable to the lord; and because of these detestable things the lord your God will drive them out before you. You shall not be blameless before the Lord your God. For those nations, which you shall dispossess, listen to those who practice witchcraft and to diviners, but as for you, the Lord your God has not allowed you to do so (Deuteronomy 18:9-14, NASB).[/blockquote]
To God, all of these magical arts were an abomination.
Isaiah declared that all of Babylon"s sorceries and spells would be unable to avert the punishment that God would inflict against her (Isaiah 47:8-15). This observation points to a significant conclusion. The Bible repeatedly portrays those who claim sorcerous powers as fakes and counterfeits (e.g., Genesis 41:8; Exodus 7:10-12; Daniel 2:2-11). Even the action of the so-called "witch of Endor," who actually is identified in the text as a "medium" (NKJV) or having a "familiar spirit" (KJV) [1 Samuel 28:3ff.], must be deemed fraudulent for three reasons: (1) she was surprised that a spirit actually appeared (vs. 12); (2) she thought the spirit was elohim"the Hebrew word for God or gods (vs. 13); and (3) she did not recognize Samuel, but had to describe him to Saul who in turn recognized him (vs. 14). In the New Testament, the claims of both Simon in Acts 8 and Elymas in Acts 13 also were bogus. All these sorcerers and astrologers were fakes who had no real power"though they fooled a lot of people into thinking they did.
Astrology, witchcraft, sorcery, spiritualism, and yes, those who claim to be "psychic mediums," are all condemned by God. Why? Because these practices implicitly present themselves as substitutes for God, the one and only true power of the Universe, and His Word, the one and only valid spiritual guide. No wonder witchcraft is listed as a work of the flesh (Galatians 5:20). No wonder the Bible declares in no uncertain terms that "sorcerers...shall have their part in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death" (Revelation 21:8). The only "crossing over" that is actually occurring is by those whose spirits exit their bodies (i.e., they die) and who then are transported to the hadean realm to await the Day of Judgment and eternity. Their abode is fixed and unchanging (Luke 16:26-31).
CONCLUSION
The Bible speaks decisively and definitively on the subject of demon possession, witchcraft, astrology, sorcery, divination, enchantment, and wizardry. With a united and concerted voice, God"s Word condemns it and pronounces it false. People could be possessed by demons for a brief period of time in the first century. But this phenomenon has ceased. Those who wish to be Christians"those who wish to be pleasing to God"will give no credence to such claims today. No doubt, many of us like to break open that fortune cookie at the oriental restaurant and read the note inside; we might even occasionally glance at our horoscope in the newspaper"but only as a source of amusement, because there is absolutely no validity to it. The moment a person puts trust in such, and thinks that the future is determined by such, he or she is trusting in something other than God, and is sinning.
The only reliable guide in life is the Bible. It is a lamp to our feet and a light to our path (Psalm 119:105). The Word of God is living and active, quick and powerful (Hebrews 4:12). It is the sword of the Spirit (Ephesians 6:17). By that Word we will be judged one day (John 12:48). May we set aside all other claims to guidance and rely solely and strictly upon the Bible, wonderful words of life"the all-sufficient and authoritative Word of God.
Moose;Rightly divide the word Brother.
and also I will cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to pass out of the land (Zechariah 13:1-2).
We have had our debates where you maintained that prophets had been done away with. Now we are being told that unclean spirits have been done away with also. Isn't it great that all we have in the land now are "clean" spirits. When did this purging take place? Is there a scripture that says that this has already came to pass? If there is an unclean spirit in the land, isn't it possible that there is a prophet left also? If the prophets are gone and an unclean spirit is left, does that show God as only half way doing his job? If the unclean spirit has been taken from the land, where is all the ungodliness coming from? You just had a post on the evils of the world recently. As usual, I am confused about where you are coming from and where you are going.
Moose, I did read the whole post! However, I'm confused. Are you saying that the bible says that Satan and demons have absolutely no influence on earth? That's what it sounded like. Unfortunately, I'm not nearly as versed in the Bible as you are. Short answer please, I get confused easy!!
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While you rest, someone, somewhere, is training. When you meet, you will lose.
Exorcism
