I have thought about this one pretty good. On the surface we could as LBR said produce a lot of scriptures for both sides. I may produce a couple but I will tell you why I don"t like that doctrine. First I must tell you this is my 3rd page I"ve written. The others have been deleted. I"ll tell you what. I won"t try to talk you good folks out of how you should believe but I will tell you why I believe the way I do.
I believe my belief produces a good fear.
19:9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether. 19:10 More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb. 19:11 Moreover by them is thy servant WARNED: and in keeping of them there is great reward.
Matthew7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that DOETH THE WILL OF MY FATHER which is in heaven.
Also , the 10 virgins. They all had lamps. They were ALL going to meet the bridegroom. FIVE ½ were unwise. Were not filled with the oil . They went to their fellow friends and ask for help. They said no. Here is the Lord"s final verse for these 5 " Matt, 25 :12" Verily I say unto you ,I KNOW YE NOT."
Matthew 25: 31-46 the Sheep and the goats. Notice 44 the goats call Him Lord, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
End result 46 Everlasting Punishment
I Corinthians3:17 If ANY MAN defile the temple of God, him shall God DESTROY; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
I Corinthians 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. Castaway,Greek { ad ok ee mos} rejected
let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. 1 John 3:7b,8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
That is all I"m saying. Real Christians don"t make light of sin. Jesus is Lord over their entire life. It"s simple".."Ye shall know them by their fruits."
Love ya,
Chuck
After reading Motor's reply ...and talking with Strut ...this is too high for me. I can't play God.I really must admit I'm not sold either way. I do believe I am saved. And........I believe you folks are too.
God bless,
Brother Chuck
chuck it is beneath you to make insinuations that i make light of sin and that i am playing God..and i might add that none of the verses you posted have anything to do with losing your salvation..i am sorry that you feel that way so this will be my last post here..i pray you will have a good life and that God will bless you and yours in a mighty way..
__________________
wayne
"There's room at the cross for you."
Oh my brother........ you misread my post or reply. I was talking about the fellows my son hangs around with. They are some pretty rough baptist.Here is what I had in my mind when I wrote that remark. Chris, a baptist friend came to our home last weekend for dinner, His T-shirt read STOP LOOKING AT MY NUTS! I was going to have him change shirts but my wife talked me out of it.
This is the weakness of writing words on a forum. I would never ever say something like that to you. I have a great respect for you.I am very sorry for the misunderstanding. Please forgive me.
Your brother in Christ,
Chuck
editing for clarification
Leaf,
I believe we are in agreement on this area. The fear of the Lord is clean. he has chaastized me with His rod and filled my cup to over flowing with His Spirit. His plumb line of holiness keeps my heart sober. I have counted the cost. As a new believer the reminder of Hell kept me from looking back. As an older Christian His love compells me to stay in His arms.
Chuck
An act of sin does not cost you your salvation. There are people who teach that if you sin once after you have acepted Jesus, you must be saved again. But this is not what the Bible teaches.
Like I said before, can you conceive of somebody adopting a child and then throwing it on the street because it falls short of the family's expectations. When we are saved, we are adopted into the family of God. We must, out of love on one hand and godly fear on the other, seek to live a life that is pleasing to Him. But the idea that one act of sin would cause someone to be thrown out of God's family is not in the Bible. (1st John 7-9). However, act of sin or rebellion will take away the joy of your salvation. When David sinned he had no joy, because he had rebelled against God (Ps. 51:12). He said, "Do not take Your Holy Spirit from me" (Ps.51:12). Even though he had committed adultery and had been responsible for an innocent man's death, by this clear statement we are shown that he still had the Holy Spirit. Though punishment came due to his sin, nevertheless, God forgave and loved him because David was repentant before the Lord.
If one continues in a course of known sin, assurance of one's salvation may be lost, but that is not the same as an actual loss of one's salvation. When the Scripture says, "Whoever is born of God does not sin" ( 1st John 5:18), the sense of the Greek is not that a Christian never commits an act of sin, but that he does not continue in a course of sin, refusing to confess and repent of his sins. A person born of the Spirit of God will be drawn back to repentance every time he sins.
Beyond that, we do read in Hebrews 10:29 that if somebody actually says the blood of Jesus Christ is a common (unholy) thing and renounces the salvation he has received, then that person may have lost it all! But the same book says, "But beloved, we are confident of better things concerning you" (Heb. 6:9). It is very hard to believe that someone who has been born again would turn that far away from God.
But one might ask, if we are new creatures in Christ, why do we even still have the capacity to sin? The answer is that perfection for the Christian awaits us in heaven (1st Cor. 15:54). Now, we are united with Jesus at salvation, but we are being proggressively transformed into His image (2nd Cor. 3:18). We are being changed throughout our lives, but the is no final moment, short of death, when the believers becomes sinlessly perfect (1st John 1:8).
Rev,
I can certainly see Christ's spirit in your answer. I believe probably 99 % with you. His love will take up the slack.Looking back at my own life I see a God who is rich in love and mercy. I believe like Charles Finny. The problem is ..is " telling a Christian that he can expect to sin." like it is a normal thing to continue in your old lifestyle. With that mental attitudeyou get the following .....
1. Every one sins anyway so what's it your business if were living together.
2.Or the first man I talked to in jail. Yes I shot her husband with a 30-06 but God's love endureth forever and I am still heaven bound.
3. My wife invited a person to church. Joy had not been in church for years. her reply.." I know I don't go to church anymore but I am Baptist...I'm saved forever anyway."
Beyond that, we do read in Hebrews 10:29 that if somebody actually says the blood of Jesus Christ is a common (unholy) thing and renounces the salvation he has received, then that person may have lost it all!
Quote:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Rev, for some reason I have never noticed that particular scripture before. Do you see this as the same as blaspheming the Holy Spirit? This would have come in handy with a person I was talking to just a short while ago.
Quote:
Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:
__________________ And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
I agree with you brother, those are the ones that ever experience "The Joy of the Lord." Those are the ones that I question, have you been saved? Really given your heart to Jesus, not just went to the alter to make an apperance. Some get caught up in the preaching, the music and get a good feeling and run down to the alter, but as soon as they leave the church, they are back to what they were doing. Going to the bank and getting a withdraw, doesn't make a person a banker. The key question is have you really and truly given your heart to Jesus.
Maybe the question shouldn't be "once saved always saved", the question maybe should be rephrased, " Did you mean it when you gave your heart to Jesus?"
I use this old saying alot, No change, No Jesus!
To my Eternal Security friends.
Looking back at my own life I see a God who is rich in love and mercy. I believe like Charles Finny. The problem is ..is " telling a Christian that he can expect to sin." like it is a normal thing to continue in your old lifestyle. With that mental attitudeyou get the following .....
