Honestly can we have experts/sociologists write these laws instead of politicians?
What about offenders who didn't even have sex with a minor?
Should touching count as the same as intercourse?
I'm willing to bet many of these "minors" are scarred more through going through the legal system to convict and the parent badgering than from the initial act itself, ie...essentially makingout with their boyf.
This kind of injustice is perpetrated by excessively puritanical cops and prosecutors who, I suspect, are jealous because someone else is getting a little and they aren't.
If a parent complains, which is the usual source, the guy could just as well be charged with disorderly conduct or even contributing to the delinquency of a minor, neither of which is a sex offense.
I've seen the same kind of attitude on this forum with people getting their panties in a twist because my husband is older than I am, even though I was old enough to consent in this state.
__________________
Proud parents of our own "Daddy's Little Girls"
I heard Jesus He drank wine and I bet we'd get along just fine.
I have mixed feelings on this one. A 19 year old and a 15 year old? Most 15 year olds are not mentally mature enough for such a relationship, not to mention the law is the law.
Where would you draw the line? She lived with her parents, the relationship was obviously against their consent, he broke the law. Why should he be the exception? What if he had been 18 and she were 14? 17 and 13?
I feel like there should be a way to get off the list in "special" circumstances, as in this one where it was his only offense and they went on to marry...but again, where do you draw the line? If her parents said "ok"? How does that change the law? Can kids start drinking at 15 as long as the parents give the ok?
If it were my daughter, I'd have done the same thing. Shoot, if it had been my son at 15 and a 19 year woman old seduced him I would have filed charges. Based on the article, I don't think he deserves to remain on the list, but he did break the law.
Chad
__________________
"We can have no '50-50' allegiance in this country. Either a man is an American and nothing else, or he is not an American at all."-- Theodore Roosevelt
A wise man's heart is at his right hand; but a fool's heart at his left. Ecclesiasties 10:2
The last four letters in American..........I Can
The last four letters in Republican........I Can
The last four letters in Democrats.........Rats
I have mixed feelings on this one. A 19 year old and a 15 year old? Most 15 year olds are not mentally mature enough for such a relationship, not to mention the law is the law.
Where would you draw the line? She lived with her parents, the relationship was obviously against their consent, he broke the law. Why should he be the exception? What if he had been 18 and she were 14? 17 and 13?
I feel like there should be a way to get off the list in "special" circumstances, as in this one where it was his only offense and they went on to marry...but again, where do you draw the line? If her parents said "ok"? How does that change the law? Can kids start drinking at 15 as long as the parents give the ok?
If it were my daughter, I'd have done the same thing. Shoot, if it had been my son at 15 and a 19 year woman old seduced him I would have filed charges. Based on the article, I don't think he deserves to remain on the list, but he did break the law.
Chad
Your last point, which I highlighted, is what we're discussing here. The punishment here, for engaging in fairly typical behavior for teenagers, is far too extreme.
As I pointed out, he could have been charged with contributing to the delinquency of a minor, a serious offense, but not a sex offense resulting in a lifetime stigma.
Do parents have the right to approve/disapprove of the behavior of their teenage children? I believe they do.
If my mother had forbidden me to move in with my husband, would I have obeyed? Yes.
Had she forbidden me to see him, would I have obeyed? I was a very obedient daughter, but no, I would have continued to see him.
As a recent female high school and middle school student, I am in a position to know a little about the behavior of teenage girls. Many of you fathers would be amazed, (appalled?) to know how many of your daughters have engaged in sex, or are doing so.
In the case under discussion, the girl told her mother. Very few girls tell their parents, unless a pregnancy happens.
__________________
Proud parents of our own "Daddy's Little Girls"
I heard Jesus He drank wine and I bet we'd get along just fine.
This kind of injustice is perpetrated by excessively puritanical cops and prosecutors who, I suspect, are jealous because someone else is getting a little and they aren't.
I presume this is some sort of humor. Although prosecutors do have some leeway in who they charge, they are not supposed to simply ignore a crime. Most cops that I know (and I'm a cop) would love to see the laws change as they believe that some issues would best be handled as a family decision instead of making it a crime. Jealousy isn't really part of the decision to arrest or not.
If a parent complains, which is the usual source, the guy could just as well be charged with disorderly conduct or even contributing to the delinquency of a minor, neither of which is a sex offense.
A prosecutor is supposed to charge accurately instead of just deciding 1 guy gets a break and the other doesn't. The prosecutor is also supposed to decline to file if the case doesn't meet a sufficient level of proof, i.e. beyond a reasonable doubt.
I've seen the same kind of attitude on this forum with people getting their panties in a twist because my husband is older than I am, even though I was old enough to consent in this state.
The situation with your husband illustrated a perfect issue for this forum--Different states have different ages of consent and what is illegal in one member's state is perfectly legal in another member's state. For instance, in California, the age of consent is 18, In many other states, the age of consent is lower and perfectly legal.
Going back to the original issue, most state legislatures and their politicians did have some kind of input from "experts/sociologists" as well as parents and various groups purporting to represent their members' points of view.
In most states, the age of consent was established as a legal means of addressing the monetary issue of reimbursing the public treasuries for the costs of young pregnant girls going on welfare for babies procreated by older males (generally in their 20's) having sex with underage girls (age depends on each state's age of consent). It's a situation that lumps everybody into the same boat and attempts to use the law to address what is most often better addressed as a family issue and/or with a paternity suit in a family court of law.
FWIW, there really is no perfect age as individuals are different and some 15 year old females are more mature at 15 than some females will ever be even in their 60's. And, by the way, these laws apply equally to older women having sex with underage males. That doesn't get reported that often unless they're a teacher in a public school.
I will say that there does need to be some age below which it flat out is a sex crime, pure and simple. 15 might be too old for some people's point of view but I doubt anybody would disagree that 6 is too young or even 12. Ages 13 1nd 14 probably get into the age for some states' legal age of consent although I personally think those ages might be a little young. That's another discussion though.
Salukipv1's original post is a great topic to discuss although it isn't quite as simple as salukipv1 would make it to be and it isn't motivated by sachiko's thoughts about prosecutors and police either. It honestly needs to be addressed in all 50 states' legislatures as the current laws do create ridiculous situations like the one salukiv1 quoted in the original article. The results of that particular application of the law are completely unjust and inappropriate. I'm surprised Rodriguez is not seeking/obtaining a Governor's Pardon which would exonerate him from the crime and completely erase it from any records so he could coach his kids' sports teams and get a better job, etc. Perhaps Sal can contact the gentlemen with some wise advice on this.
__________________
Jesus Christ--The reason for the season!
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can read this in English, thank a veteran.
If you're certain you know everything, there's little opportunity to learn anything.
The situation with your husband illustrated a perfect issue for this forum--Different states have different ages of consent and what is illegal in one member's state is perfectly legal in another member's state. For instance, in California, the age of consent is 18, In many other states, the age of consent is lower and perfectly legal.
Going back to the original issue, most state legislatures and their politicians did have some kind of input from "experts/sociologists" as well as parents and various groups purporting to represent their members' points of view.
In most states, the age of consent was established as a legal means of addressing the monetary issue of reimbursing the public treasuries for the costs of young pregnant girls going on welfare for babies procreated by older males (generally in their 20's) having sex with underage girls (age depends on each state's age of consent). It's a situation that lumps everybody into the same boat and attempts to use the law to address what is most often better addressed as a family issue and/or with a paternity suit in a family court of law.
FWIW, there really is no perfect age as individuals are different and some 15 year old females are more mature at 15 than some females will ever be even in their 60's. And, by the way, these laws apply equally to older women having sex with underage males. That doesn't get reported that often unless they're a teacher in a public school.
I will say that there does need to be some age below which it flat out is a sex crime, pure and simple. 15 might be too old for some people's point of view but I doubt anybody would disagree that 6 is too young or even 12. Ages 13 1nd 14 probably get into the age for some states' legal age of consent although I personally think those ages might be a little young. That's another discussion though.
Salukipv1's original post is a great topic to discuss although it isn't quite as simple as salukipv1 would make it to be and it isn't motivated by sachiko's thoughts about prosecutors and police either. It honestly needs to be addressed in all 50 states' legislatures as the current laws do create ridiculous situations like the one salukiv1 quoted in the original article. The results of that particular application of the law are completely unjust and inappropriate. I'm surprised Rodriguez is not seeking/obtaining a Governor's Pardon which would exonerate him from the crime and completely erase it from any records so he could coach his kids' sports teams and get a better job, etc. Perhaps Sal can contact the gentlemen with some wise advice on this.
I presume this is some sort of humor. Although prosecutors do have some leeway in who they charge, they are not supposed to simply ignore a crime. Most cops that I know (and I'm a cop) would love to see the laws change as they believe that some issues would best be handled as a family decision instead of making it a crime. Jealousy isn't really part of the decision to arrest or not.
If a parent complains, which is the usual source, the guy could just as well be charged with disorderly conduct or even contributing to the delinquency of a minor, neither of which is a sex offense.
A prosecutor is supposed to charge accurately instead of just deciding 1 guy gets a break and the other doesn't. The prosecutor is also supposed to decline to file if the case doesn't meet a sufficient level of proof, i.e. beyond a reasonable doubt.
--------------------------------------
With all due respect, you're absolutely wrong. They plead cases down all the time. Please remember that my husband is a lawyer who does criminal defense. While he doesn't reveal confidences, I hear all kinds of "war stories."
One of his most recent "triumphs" was getting his client's two felonies reduced to a midemeanor. And the judge openly informed his client that, if she paid the fine and costs before sentencing, he wouldn't even put her on probation.
He has a client right now, a juvenile originally charged with a sex offense. (This is not a Romeo and Juliet type case.) The charge was reduced to a non-registry offense, (indecent exposure) contingent on the kid going through the program being set up through the juvenile court. My husband has worked through the case and has been able to assure the kid that he will stay in his mother's custody and will not be locked up anywhere.
Apparently prosecutors here are reluctant to charge someone with a sex crime where it involves a teenage romance.
Also, if the girl, (It's usually a girl, who is the "victim,") refuses to testify, the case gets dismissed.
And, please, don't try to tell us that cops never charge anyone based on their personal emotions or prejudices. I'll believe you if you tell me you never have, but please don't try to tell us it never happens. Cops, like priests, can differ with respect to their moral standards.
__________________
Proud parents of our own "Daddy's Little Girls"
I heard Jesus He drank wine and I bet we'd get along just fine.
It even gets worse than the example cited. Young folks get put on "sex offender" lists for sending photos of themselves to another person. This is just crazy.
BTW: The US imprisons more folks than China and Russia combined. In the US OK is ranked third in number of prison inmates. The US prison industry employs more folks than the entire US auto industry. Got to keep those prisons full; it's good for the US economy: Wrong!!!
I ask again: where do you draw the line? Is it ok for a 15 year old to get polluted drunk on the weekends as long as it's done with parental consent?
As far as the "plea bargaining", that's a farce for the most part, so prosecutors don't have to do their job. Just because you plead murder 1 down to manslaughter doesn't make the crime any less heinous.
Chad
__________________
"We can have no '50-50' allegiance in this country. Either a man is an American and nothing else, or he is not an American at all."-- Theodore Roosevelt
A wise man's heart is at his right hand; but a fool's heart at his left. Ecclesiasties 10:2
The last four letters in American..........I Can
The last four letters in Republican........I Can
The last four letters in Democrats.........Rats
I have mixed feelings on this one. A 19 year old and a 15 year old? Most 15 year olds are not mentally mature enough for such a relationship, not to mention the law is the law.
Where would you draw the line? She lived with her parents, the relationship was obviously against their consent, he broke the law. Why should he be the exception? What if he had been 18 and she were 14? 17 and 13?
I feel like there should be a way to get off the list in "special" circumstances, as in this one where it was his only offense and they went on to marry...but again, where do you draw the line? If her parents said "ok"? How does that change the law? Can kids start drinking at 15 as long as the parents give the ok?
If it were my daughter, I'd have done the same thing. Shoot, if it had been my son at 15 and a 19 year woman old seduced him I would have filed charges. Based on the article, I don't think he deserves to remain on the list, but he did break the law.
Chad
Wrong? Sure.
Huge difference from a 50yo pervert with an 8yo, than from a college/hs age guy with a hs age girl IMO.
Should these types be lifetime sex offender registers? No.
Should these types be convicted felons/and never own a firearm again when their case has nothing to do with violence or a firearm? No.
Honestly every state having different laws of consent doesn't help I don't think, 16, 17, 18, legal in 1 state, illegal in another, doesn't make much sense at all.
Like Rev said, it would be interesting to know the stats on just how many out there could have been arrested for something like this in their lifetime. So just throw the book at those caught? more laws/restrictions etc...
Sex offender laws and tax $$ at work!
