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John Adams “The moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence.”
Ronald Reagan: 'Everybody that is for abortion has already been born'
"I never said I was worth it. I only said I wouldn't do it for less " William F. Buckley Jr.
Freeloaders take many forms. Huge agri-businesses take millions in farm welfare money every year. over 75 percent of farm subsidy money goes to ten percent of "farmers".
In 2009 Jeff White was the farm welfare prince of Comanche county, OK.
I agree that in this country there are many free-loaders of every type and description. I see PLENTY of it right here in the tax office. The govermernment in many ways encourages it....although in many ways I don't think that the encouragement was what was sought....its just that, like often, the results do not match the intent.
One specific issue I'd like to raise is:
are people that default on their mortgage free-loaders???
I don't think so. Now perhaps this comes from the thought that my wife and I are wrestling with this issue ourselves. At first it seemed like some possible moral issue...and there is definately a perceived stigma to it. But, in the end, I see it as a business contract between us and the bank. If we break that contract, there are consequences. If we are willing to pay the consequences, then, I believe, we have the option to adhere to the contract or not.
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Looney tunes deductive reasoning:
--Me smell Mohican burning
--Me last Mohican
--Must be me!!!
--EEEOOOWWW!!!!!
Last edited by hillbillyhunter1; 03-25-2011 at 06:59 AM.
Location: land of the Lilliputians, In the state of insanity
Posts: 24,186
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillbillyhunter1
are people that default on their mortgage free-loaders???
I don't think so. Now perhaps this comes from the thought that my wife and I are wrestling with this issue ourselves. At first it seemed like some possible moral issue...and there is definately a perceived stigma to it. But, in the end, I see it as a business contract between us and the bank. If we break that contract, there are consequences. If we are willing to pay the consequences, then, I believe, we have the option to adhere to the contract or not.
The difference, is; People who try, and hard times fall on them, I do not consider a freeloader. A person who does not intend on working, doesn't try to better themselves, think they are entitled to money they did not earn, and sucks off the government tit, is a freeloader.
As for defaulting on a mortgage, that comes with its own set of consequences. A freeloader has no consequences to their action. I might be wrong, but it works out in my mind that way.
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kaafir mushrik
Unintended consequences and God have one thing in common: Liberals don’t believe in either of them.
J.F.K. hated liberals.
Last edited by burniegoeasily; 03-25-2011 at 08:06 AM.
Freeloaders take many forms. Huge agri-businesses take millions in farm welfare money every year. over 75 percent of farm subsidy money goes to ten percent of "farmers".
In 2009 Jeff White was the farm welfare prince of Comanche county, OK.
$16 Billion a year? While I agree that most of those getting the subsidies don't need, and shouldn't be getting them, I bet it would be fairly easy to find ten times that much in fraudulent payments to those on welfare and disability. I think the stuff Stossel mentions in his article about $50,000 to African-American folks who "tried to farm" is obscene. We're paying off WAY more people than were ever farmers...
Also... A significant portion of the "farm subsidies" are paid for the conservation reserve program, and I don't have any problem with that, regardless of how big the farmer is... Even those lousy "corporate" farmers. The government has made the determination that it is beneficial to wildlife to keep certain land out of production. It pays the farmers "rent" for this. The ducks get little ponds to stop in on their flight south. The pheasants and deer get some quality habitat. The government's "conservation" goal is achieved. The farmers get paid to take otherwise productive land out of production. The farmers are giving up the amount they could have earned had they planted crops on that land. Seems to me that being paid to help achieve the government's goal is perfectly reasonable.
The difference, is; People who try, and hard times fall on them, I do not consider a freeloader.
so when is the cut off? a week, month, 3 month.... We now have people getting 2 years of unemployment. That's welfare by another name. As far as I'm concerned, its what charities are for in your own communities. The very fact that one day you may be forced to rely on the generosity of your neighbors ends up having a positive effect on how you treat them.
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John Adams “The moment the idea is admitted into society that property is not as sacred as the laws of God, and that there is not a force of law and public justice to protect it, anarchy and tyranny commence.”
Ronald Reagan: 'Everybody that is for abortion has already been born'
"I never said I was worth it. I only said I wouldn't do it for less " William F. Buckley Jr.
Location: land of the Lilliputians, In the state of insanity
Posts: 24,186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fieldmouse
so when is the cut off? a week, month, 3 month.... We now have people getting 2 years of unemployment. That's welfare by another name. As far as I'm concerned, its what charities are for in your own communities. The very fact that one day you may be forced to rely on the generosity of your neighbors ends up having a positive effect on how you treat them.
When is the cut off? Good question. I do not like the idea of government taking care of folks. I was refering to the mindset of a freeloader and someone down on their luck. Regardless of the avenue the charity/welfare comes from. Churchs and private charities are taken advantage of as well by freeloaders.
__________________
kaafir mushrik
Unintended consequences and God have one thing in common: Liberals don’t believe in either of them.
I agree that in this country there are many free-loaders of every type and description. I see PLENTY of it right here in the tax office. The govermernment in many ways encourages it....although in many ways I don't think that the encouragement was what was sought....its just that, like often, the results do not match the intent.
One specific issue I'd like to raise is:
are people that default on their mortgage free-loaders???
I don't think so. Now perhaps this comes from the thought that my wife and I are wrestling with this issue ourselves. At first it seemed like some possible moral issue...and there is definately a perceived stigma to it. But, in the end, I see it as a business contract between us and the bank. If we break that contract, there are consequences. If we are willing to pay the consequences, then, I believe, we have the option to adhere to the contract or not.
Ummm..... It's a little more complicated than that.
As was stated it's one thing when people are doing all they can and due to circumstances beyond their control they fail on their mortgage.
It's another when people who are perfectly able to pay their mortgage but choose to walk away because they've been caught by market conditions and suddenly find themselves underwater on their mortgage.
I can guarantee you those same people would gladly walk away with the profit had the market continued to grow, and they had turned their home over for a profit.
Instead they choose to walk away and throw their burden on the backs of those who are doing business the right way.
So in a sense you could call them freeloaders, and you can definitely call them scumbags.
It's one thing to break that contract with the bank because you can't meet the obligation. IMHO it's at least morally wrong to break that contract because you choose not to eat the loss for a decision you made, and then throw that loss on the back of everybody that are doing things right.
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Those who hammer their guns into plows, will plow for those who don't~ Thomas Jefferson~ Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held it's ground~Unknown~Just because your offended doesn't mean your right~Unknown.
America, the land of the Freeloaders??
