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Old 08-27-2008, 12:41 PM   #1
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Default Third World Country? USA v. China

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/27/op...mp;oref=slogin
[/align] A Biblical Seven Years By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN[/align] Beijing
After attending the spectacular closing ceremony at the Beijing Olympics and feeling the vibrations from hundreds of Chinese drummers pulsating in my own chest, I was tempted to conclude two things: "śHoly mackerel, the energy coming out of this country is unrivaled."ť And, two: "śWe are so cooked. Start teaching your kids Mandarin."ť
However, I"™ve learned over the years not to over-interpret any two-week event. Olympics don"™t change history. They are mere snapshots "” a country posing in its Sunday bests for all the world too see. But, as snapshots go, the one China presented through the Olympics was enormously powerful "” and it"™s one that Americans need to reflect upon this election season.


China did not build the magnificent $43 billion infrastructure for these games, or put on the unparalleled opening and closing ceremonies, simply by the dumb luck of discovering oil. No, it was the culmination of seven years of national investment, planning, concentrated state power, national mobilization and hard work.
Seven years ... Seven years ... Oh, that"™s right. China was awarded these Olympic Games on July 13, 2001 "” just two months before 9/11.



As I sat in my seat at the Bird"™s Nest, watching thousands of Chinese dancers, drummers, singers and acrobats on stilts perform their magic at the closing ceremony, I couldn"™t help but reflect on how China and America have spent the last seven years: China has been preparing for the Olympics; we"™ve been preparing for Al Qaeda. They"™ve been building better stadiums, subways, airports, roads and parks. And we"™ve been building better metal detectors, armored Humvees and pilotless drones.
The difference is starting to show. Just compare arriving at La Guardia"™s dumpy terminal in New York City and driving through the crumbling infrastructure into Manhattan with arriving at Shanghai"™s sleek airport and taking the 220-mile-per-hour magnetic levitation train, which uses electromagnetic propulsion instead of steel wheels and tracks, to get to town in a blink.


Then ask yourself: Who is living in the third world country?


Yes, if you drive an hour out of Beijing, you meet the vast dirt-poor third world of China. But here"™s what"™s new: The rich parts of China, the modern parts of Beijing or Shanghai or Dalian, are now more state of the art than rich America. The buildings are architecturally more interesting, the wireless networks more sophisticated, the roads and trains more efficient and nicer. And, I repeat, they did not get all this by discovering oil. They got it by digging inside themselves.
I realize the differences: We were attacked on 9/11; they were not. We have real enemies; theirs are small and mostly domestic. We had to respond to 9/11 at least by eliminating the Al Qaeda base in Afghanistan and investing in tighter homeland security. They could avoid foreign entanglements. Trying to build democracy in Iraq, though, which I supported, was a war of choice and is unlikely to ever produce anything equal to its huge price tag.
But the first rule of holes is that when you"™re in one, stop digging. When you see how much modern infrastructure has been built in China since 2001, under the banner of the Olympics, and you see how much infrastructure has been postponed in America since 2001, under the banner of the war on terrorism, it"™s clear that the next seven years need to be devoted to nation-building in America.


We need to finish our business in Iraq and Afghanistan as quickly as possible, which is why it is a travesty that the Iraqi Parliament has gone on vacation while 130,000 U.S. troops are standing guard. We can no longer afford to postpone our nation-building while Iraqis squabble over whether to do theirs.
A lot of people are now advising Barack Obama to get dirty with John McCain. Sure, fight fire with fire. That"™s necessary, but it is not sufficient.


Obama got this far because many voters projected onto him that he could be the leader of an American renewal. They know we need nation-building at home now "” not in Iraq, not in Afghanistan, not in Georgia, but in America. Obama cannot lose that theme.



He cannot let Republicans make this election about who is tough enough to stand up to Russia or bin Laden. It has to be about who is strong enough, focused enough, creative enough and unifying enough to get Americans to rebuild America. The next president can have all the foreign affairs experience in the world, but it will be useless, utterly useless, if we, as a country, are weak.



Obama is more right than he knows when he proclaims that this is "śour"ť moment, this is "śour"ť time. But it is our time to get back to work on the only home we have, our time for nation-building in America. I never want to tell my girls "” and I"™m sure Obama feels the same about his "” that they have to go to China to see the future.
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Old 08-27-2008, 01:24 PM   #2
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Quote:
Obama got this far because many voters projected onto him that he could be the leader of an American renewal. They know we need nation-building at home now "” not in Iraq, not in Afghanistan, not in Georgia, but in America. Obama cannot lose that theme.
Couldn't be farther from the truth. Obama got this far because the liberal press including the NYT wanted him to and they propped him up with bogus articles and left him unchallenged and untested. It is showing up now that it's the real test not some beauty pagent called Democrat debates which were anything but real debates.
Quote:
He cannot let Republicans make this election about who is tough enough to stand up to Russia or bin Laden. It has to be about who is strong enough, focused enough, creative enough and unifying enough to get Americans to rebuild America. The next president can have all the foreign affairs experience in the world, but it will be useless, utterly useless, if we, as a country, are weak.
Too late, we have real issues out there insead of the bogus stuff the Dems like to talk about. Secondly, Obama hasn't unified anything ever! He has the most liberal voting record in the senate and Biden isn't far behind. This election is and will be all about Obama until he steps aside and is replaced before the November elections.

Let me ask this question on this thread, how far do you dems allow Obama's numbers to drop until you throw in the towel?
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Old 08-27-2008, 01:27 PM   #3
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Default RE: Third World Country? USA v. China

I havethree different comments to make.

First comment: I think by almost any fair comparison between China and the US you will find that the US is far ahead of China. Tell me how reliable the electricity grid is across China. Tell me how reliable and comprehensive the telecommunications grid is across China. Tell me how many airports there are in China (Okahoma City, Tulsa, Little Rock, Sante Fe, etc., all have airports in the US). Tell me how extensive and well maintained the road networks are in China. No, there is no comparison.

Second comment: China can arguably be said to have been stuck in a time warp circa 1950 for many years. China, relatively speaking, has only recently become freed to develop its economy fully. It is important to see where China has come from andto seewhere they are going. Economists predict that India's economy will exceed the US economy perhaps in 2025 and that China's economy will exceed India's economy perhaps in 2050. The Chinese are extremely hard workers. They are extremely motivated students. I don't know how many Chinese people I meet here in the US with Ph'Ds. Very, very motivated to invest in their educations. I'm told that engineers at a Chinese telecommunications company customarily work 80 hour work weeks -- not on exceptional events but all the time. These guys WILL kick our butt, it is just a matter of when this will happen. I'm not going to work that hard. I want to enjoy my leisure and time with my family.

Third comment: We have a different culture here in the US, or at least we have until recently, from that of the Chinese and the orientals in general. As one example, we are more individuals; the orientals are more directed to the community. There are many things that flow out of these general cultural differences. One of the things that flows out of or is related to the Oriental culture is that, generally, underlings do not question or contest the decisions and/or attitudes of superiors. This has an effect on entrepreneurialism and on innovation. In the US innovation can come from the ground up. Take the case of Robert Noyce and Robert Shockly. Shockly was the big dog and a dominating personality who squashed the ideas of Noyce and others. Noyce quit and with others founded his own semiconductor company, going on to make dramatic and seminal semiconductor innovations. I can't help but think that in an oriental country Noyce would have been much more likely to duck his head and bow down to Shockly's will. The hard work and the deep commitment to education are effects of the oriental culture -- good effects. Maybe the bad effects of the oriental culture -- largely blind submission to superiors -- will limit the ability of China to lead and surpass the west? It is only a speculation. Time will tell.

One last point. The Chinese are much better savers than we in the US. Maybe these hardworking, thrifty Chinese will end up by owning our businesses and farm lands and, substantially, us?!!!
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Old 08-27-2008, 01:31 PM   #4
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Default RE: Third World Country? USA v. China

LOL.

If our federal government focused entirely on New York City and said to hell with the rest of the country, NYC would make Beijing look like a child's sand castle by comparison. What an incredibly shallow, ill-conceived column.
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Old 08-27-2008, 01:31 PM   #5
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Default RE: Third World Country? USA v. China

Perhaps one of the biggest P.O.S. posts I've read on here in a long while. Comparing us to China because of the infrastructure at the Olympics. WOW, is that ever thought-provoking.

Perhaps if armed guards were ready to deport everyone in this country who spoke against or protested government policy, we could be more like them...and may not need all those fancy metal detectors.

Thanks, but I'll take freedom.

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Old 08-27-2008, 01:37 PM   #6
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Default RE: Third World Country? USA v. China

Here's an idea, anyone and everyone that thinks China is a better place to live, pack your bags, get on an airplane and move there!! Wonder how many minutes after the last news footage was shot and all the cars and smog producing manufacturers fired up before the nasty smog was back!!

GO TO CHINA AND SEE THE FUTURE,, Are you kidding me, the smog is so thick you can't see across the street!!
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Old 08-27-2008, 01:40 PM   #7
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Default RE: Third World Country? USA v. China

On the other hand, theChinese could starvemany of usto death by refusing to send us any more microwave ovens.

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Old 08-27-2008, 02:26 PM   #8
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Default RE: Third World Country? USA v. China

China has to buy water to drink, they had to spend 20Gs a day to have people clean their cesspool that was used for the rowing competition. Yep, a few got money, but they don"™t have clean water or air. If we repeal our child labor laws, and get rid of the minimum wage, we could exploit our population and do great great things like China. Human rights is not a big issue for them.
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Old 08-27-2008, 02:27 PM   #9
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Oh yea, this was about the Olympics. Simple possed photo of China. If this is a testament to greatness, I believe the 84 Olympics set the standard.
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Old 08-27-2008, 03:10 PM   #10
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I don't know how many people saw this but there was also pictures of the neighborhoods they couldn't clean up in time. You know what they did? They built pretty walls to hide them. Simular to the walls you see to block highway noise from neighborhoods. They made them look like actual buildings with simulated windows and such. You know, like the simulated make believe stuff your hearing each night from denver.
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