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Old 06-16-2008, 07:31 AM   #1
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Let's get away from the Hussein and Muslim catch-phrases, shall we?

Unfortunately, both our presidential candidates seem to ignore the part of the 2nd Amendment that says "SHALL NOT" be infringed.

But let's not lose sight of what Barack Obama says on his website regarding guns. He says that he believes the 2nd Amendment creates an individual right to bear arms and that he respects that right, but here's what he says:

Quote:
Millions of hunters own and use guns each year. Millions more participate in a variety of shooting sports such as sporting clays, skeet, target and trap shooting that may not necessarily involve hunting . . . He will protect the rights of hunters and other law-abiding Americans to purchase, own, transport, and use guns for the purposes of hunting and target shooting. He also believes that the right is subject to reasonable and commonsense regulation.
You'll note that explicitly absent from Obama's statement is any mention of the use of firearms for self-defense, the most fundamental reason for the 2nd Amendment and for owning guns in the first place. He doesn't mention self-defense when talking about the reasons people bear arms, and he doesn't mention self-defense when talking about protecting gun rights.

Why? A common oversight by the authors of the website? Perhaps. But it's rather conspicuous, don't you think? I cannot remember a presidential candidate in the last couple of decades who ignored the self-defense aspect. In fact, that's usually the first term out of their mouth when talking about gun rights.

Let's not forget that Obama has stated his preference for banning all handguns (in 1994), and later didn't vote for such a ban in Illinois, but didn't vote against it, either (playing his usual game of present but not voting to prevent Americans from realizing his stance on the issues). And, he's also stated his preference for banning all semi-automatic weapons (in 1998).

I'm not a huge fan of John McCain's stance on the 2nd Amendment. I fear he will sign a renewal of the Assault Weapons Ban (and let's make no mistake: The only reason Democrats in Congress haven't pushed this issue is because they realize how badly it cost them in 1994 and they want to wait until after the '08 election cycle. It WILL come up in 2009, you can bet on it). But I've never heard McCain say anything about banning handguns or semi-automatic firearms.

Be afraid of Barack Obama's stance on firearms.
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Old 06-16-2008, 01:46 PM   #2
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I suppose self defense could be the main reason our fore fathers gave us the right to bare arms however I was always under the impression we were givin that right mainlyto protect ourself from the goverment being able to form a dictatorship or something of that nature ...

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Old 06-16-2008, 01:56 PM   #3
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That begs the question of at what point the people could decided that a given gun law is unlawful and could refuse to obey it.
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Old 06-16-2008, 05:41 PM   #4
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Already happening
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Old 06-16-2008, 06:10 PM   #5
 
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ORIGINAL: Lanse couche couche

That begs the question of at what point the people could decided that a given gun law is unlawful and could refuse to obey it.
I think plenty of people out there refuse to obey gun laws ( which I feel that right now they are all reasonable, and I feel as though I can protect myself just fine without fully automatic weapons), so the question is at what point will people decide to over throw the Govt. because of a gun law.
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Old 06-16-2008, 06:57 PM   #6
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When they attempt to ban handguns...for me at least.
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Old 06-16-2008, 07:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: shamlin

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Lanse couche couche

That begs the question of at what point the people could decided that a given gun law is unlawful and could refuse to obey it.
I think plenty of people out there refuse to obey gun laws ( which I feel that right now they are all reasonable, and I feel as though I can protect myself just fine without fully automatic weapons), so the question is at what point will people decide to over throw the Govt. because of a gun law.
Come out to California, you'll see that not all laws are reasonable...


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Old 06-16-2008, 08:05 PM   #8
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It goes further than that. Obama has said that DC's gun ban was reasonable. Translation, he's for reasonable restrictions that include a TOTAL BAN!!![:@] He's trying to hoodwink the public on guns, because most will believe what he says and not look at his definition of "reasonable restrictions."
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Old 06-17-2008, 07:47 AM   #9
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Griswold


I'm not a huge fan of John McCain's stance on the 2nd Amendment. I fear he will sign a renewal of the Assault Weapons Ban (and let's make no mistake: The only reason Democrats in Congress haven't pushed this issue is because they realize how badly it cost them in 1994 and they want to wait until after the '08 election cycle. It WILL come up in 2009, you can bet on it). But I've never heard McCain say anything about banning handguns or semi-automatic firearms.
Just curious, why would you think he'd sign a renewal of the AWB? He voted against the original one. From his website:

Quote:
Assault Weapons

John McCain opposes restrictions on so-called "assault rifles" and voted consistently against such bans. Most recently he opposed an amendment to extend a ban on 19 specific firearms, and others with similar characteristics.

Importation of High Capacity Magazines

John McCain opposes bans on the importation of certain types of ammunition magazines and has voted against such limitations.
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Old 06-17-2008, 08:08 AM   #10
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Well, it's like this. In '94, he was a fairly staunch conservative. By '04, when it was time to vote to renew, he was back into conservative mode as he geared up for a run for the presidency. But during his so-called maverick years, he stated his support for a ban of assault weapons. So I guess the question is: If elected, will he maintain his newfound conservative stances, or will he (as many moderate Dems are hoping) revert back to his old maverick self? I guess you could say that I just don't trust him.

However, this thread really isn't about McCain. It's about Obama, who is unabashedly, unashamedly in support of banning handguns, assault weapons, and all semiautomatic weapons, and who feels it is OK for municipalities to follow the lead of D.C. and Chicago and try to totally ban firearms.
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