Why can't Blacks accept that sometimes they really are breaking the law ?

[kevin1]

http://enews.earthlink.net/article/pol?guid=20050715/42d734c0_3ca6_1552620050715-1168827265

I wasn't there to personally witness the incident , and if the officer truly violated departmental weapons policy I hope he gets fired , but which part of "four citations" automatically makes it racial profiling ? I'm getting more than a little sick of blacks yanking out the race card in an effort to deny responsibility for their own actions . I don't care what your job is , it doesn't matter to me that you happen to be a minister , if I'm a cop and you're violating ordinances you will be cited .

Weapons policy is strictly enforced at every precinct for every incident in which a weapon is drawn , and I've never met a cop who would just yank out his gun and wave it over traffic tickets . I have to wonder what made this officer draw his . Could it have been a direct imminent threat to his safety ? I'm not a cop , but it seems to me that with the level of training and discipline that cops have it would take more than a shouting match to make him draw .

Any LEOs care to assess this one ?

[Coastie]

There has to be a lot more to this story than the little bit in that article. I'd be willing to bet we never hear "The Rest of the Story"

[CalHunter]

It's hard to say without more of the story. In theory, a cop is much safer on a traffic stop if the people stay in the car. That makes it harder for them to attack you or gang up on you. Ideally, you want a 2nd cop there if you're going to have people get out of the car.

This story doesn't say what kind of car it was, if windows were tinted, if the cop knew how many people were in the car, whether the people still in the car were likely to assault him or not and many other things left out of this story.

Any traffic stop is always a constant assessment of the subject(s) stopped and your safety as a cop. If you tell them to remain in the car and they get out anyway, are they deaf, unable to hear due to road noise, drunk, on drugs, psycho, exploding with anger, going to attack you, etc. A person's failure to obey your command to stay in the vehicle generally doesn't mean a positive thing for a cop. The article leaves out a lot of information that's necessary to make these early judgements or assessments.

Cops generally want people to show them their hands (especially when they walk up to cops) so you can see if they have a weapon in their hand and also to prevent the subject from pulling a weapon from whatever pocket or other area where they've concealed their hand(s). Cops who don't practive this officer safety rule die every year.

In general, an officer would draw his weapon when he feels that his safety is threatened by a particular subject(s) or in a situation where things can go bad so fast that he would likely be murdered before he could draw his weapon (like approaching a blacked out car at night). Many cops approach cars they've stopped with a pistol already drawn and at their side so it's quicker to get a shot off if needed. Sometimes that extra second or even half second is the difference between going home to your wife and kids or not.

Whenever a cop has drawn a pistol and is pointing it at a person, the cop is generally ordering that person to do something (like show me your hands, get on the ground, etc.) or not to do something (as in don't come any closer, don't point that gun or knife at me, etc.). The objective is to use the pistol in an escalating force and hopefully prevent the subject(s) from forcing you to shoot them. It absolutely is not like one of those shootouts in a western where the good guy just shoots the bad guy and then rides off with the girl.

Mayor Daley sounds like he's already judged the cop without many of the facts. Not the behavior you want from your mayor or boss. Jesse Jackson is talking crap as usual and people who think through a situation will almost always develop a negative, ambulance chasing opinion of Jesse. He truly is a useless POS.

I know you're thinking a guy shouting at you isn't a danger Kevin but when that same guy is walking or running at you when you have a gun pointed at him and are likely telling him to stay back, show his hands, etc., you have to wonder if that guy isn't mad, drunk, drugged or just plain crazy enough to attack you. If he gets his hands on you, he gets access and possibly control of your gun, pepper spray, taser, baton, etc. Every year, some cops are killed with their own guns.

I could paste another 10 pages but I'm sure you realize that we all need more information to make an honest assessment of this incident. Too bad Daley, Jackson and the other whiners don't wait till they get the facts before judging people.[:@]

[kevin1]

ORIGINAL: CalHunter
I know you're thinking a guy shouting at you isn't a danger Kevin but when that same guy is walking or running at you when you have a gun pointed at him and are likely telling him to stay back, show his hands, etc., you have to wonder if that guy isn't mad, drunk, drugged or just plain crazy enough to attack you. If he gets his hands on you, he gets access and possibly control of your gun, pepper spray, taser, baton, etc. Every year, some cops are killed with their own guns.

Actually , if I were a cop and somebody got out of the car shouting at me I most certainly would consider them a threat Cal . I don't know if I would draw on them , but it would be a likely prospect . I don't envy you your job dude , I couldn't handle it .

A state trooper once pulled me over but let me go mainly because I showed concern for his safety by having my empty hands in plain sight on the wheel . I didn't take them off to get into the glovebox for the registration without first askinhg permission to do so , which I also did before slowly taking my wallet out so that he could inspect my ID .

I don't have enough facts to make an assessment here either , other than to concur that Jackson is an idiot . I'm just really sick of the race card coming out even when an offense has obviously been committed . It never seems to be their fault , it's just "the man" out to get them for being black . Pffftttt !

[skins38]

This is also a ten year vetran so he knows what he's doing. im betting that most people stay in the car when pulled over and from his past knowledge he knows when someone gets out of the car before he says to it usually means trouble. Thats my bet why he pulled his gun.

[Rickmur]

Here in NJ we had a case a few years ago where a trooper pulled over a van full of black young men on the turnpike. When the van lurchedbackwardtoward the officer the officer opened fire and killed the driver. The other occupants of the van said the van slipped into reverse.Ol Jessie Jackson, Johnie (OJ's attorney) and Al Sharpton were on this in a matter of hours claiming racial profiling with Johnie filing the law suit. I beleive the cop was found guilty and of course NJ became known as the state of racial profiling. At that point it bacame politcal profiling and the officer didn't stand a chance.

[BenGarrett]

The thing that jumped out at me the most in that story is the Good Reverend Jackson's request that a new regulation be put into place requiring officers to keep their guns holstered during traffic stops. What a buffoon. What an idiot.

As for this racial profiling horse crap . . . it's exactly that: horse crap. If I were to get pulled over tomorrow by a white cop and I opened the door and climbed out as they approached the car, their hands would probably go to their gun. DUH. Heck, I got stopped by a ranger in the national park here a while back and as the ranger was approaching the car, I opened the door and he jumped back with his hand on his gun. Too bad he wasn't black. I could've tried the race card.

My guess is that the senator thought he was going to use his influence to try and get out of a ticket, so he jumped out of the car to have a talk with the officer . . . maybe he was even going to threaten him; tell him he'd have his job. Who knows? Bottom line: He should've kept his seat attached to the car's seat like he was expected to do.

And, frankly, even if the officer pulled his gun when he wouldn't have pulled his gun if it had been a white man who climbed out of the car, I don't necessarily have a problem with it, depending on his motive. Let's face it: It's a proven fact that blacks are quite a bit more likely to commit crimes than whites. I wouldn't call the officer's actions profiling. I'd call it staying alive.

Like Kevin, I've completely tired of hearing the race card played.

[Moose75]

my dad was a cop for 25 years. I know what its like to see a big black man get out of his car, ticked off you stoped him. when you stop someone 1) they are prolly gonna be mad 2) they want to talk you out of giving them a ticket. I remember one time I was riden with my dad and we had a 18-wheeler come by us at about 95 mph. (dad had a ford F-250 unmarked and a reg. car too)well we were in the truck and we past the guy and slamed on breaks in front of him to make him stop because he cared little about the little blue light. the guy jumped out ticked off and ready to fight dad had back up on the way but he go out and to talk to the guy without his gun the black guy started to hit dad until he stuck his badge in his face first. the guy then started whinning about how we were prejudice and who he was a good man he was a decon in the baptist church. turned out he was wanted for other stuff and lol he got to go to jail. In our little town he tryed to play the race thing and failed. lol They gathered enough stuff to put him in jail for 2 years.
Also one time dad made a stop late one night his partner was asleep and dad was gonna let him sleep so he got out of the car and walked up to the car asked for his stuff nd the guy said sure he reached in his center console and then dad and the guy in the car heard a tap tap tap on the other window. It was dads partner with his gun out on the black guy. turns out the black man was getting his gun out of the console and was about to shoot dad. His partner said he just woke up and had a bad feeling so he did what he did and thank goodness saved my dads life. I say this guy in your story is full of crap! People need to let cops do their jobs. If they beat someone down that person needed it!! I would have pulled my gun on that black Sen. too.

[uncle matt]

For more info released to press you might want to check out Chicago Tribune or Sun-Times online sites. They have a bit more details in there.

I live outside Chicago, but the majority of my customers are in Chicago. I'm in the city 3,4 or 5 days a week and see how (some) Chicago cops behave themselves. I don't believe they are all a holes, but there are more than enough to go around. It is very common to see CPD cars run thru stop signs and lights w/o lights or sirens. Most of the time if they do light up, they don't siren. Can't tell you how many times I have been met in an intersection by a squad w/o any lights or siren. Then these jokers drive a block or two and pull into a 7-11 or something - real emergency, ya know.

CPD's unmarked cars are an even bigger joke than some of the clowns described above. Alternating headlights and little Radio Shaft sirens that sound like a cheap car alarm or something a kid would have on a bicycle.

The incident withMeeks never would have taken place if the cop wouldn't have been doing what CPD does all the time - acting arrogant. Want to find a cop car in Chicago? Look in the nearest NO PARKING, BUS STOP or FIRE LANE. (They'll even park on anyone's private property they want to.)That's where they park, like it's specifically reserved for them and the signs posted there are just supposed to be for citizens. There's no real need for NO PARKING (so trucks, buses, etc. can swing around corners), BUS STOP (the buses rolling around are just figments of imagination and don't actually pick the people up who are standing in the bus stops, they're actors or something) and if they park squad cars in the FIRE LANE it will not create an obstruction or hurdle if fire apparatus has to get in there. (CPD squads are made of a special material that fire hoses and firemen can just walk right thru like ghosts).

Like I said arrogant.

If the cop who drew on Meeks hadn't been parked in the "middle of the street" (I actually read the squad was sitting at a stop sign for several minutes when Meeks instructed the car's driver to go around. That's when the squad deemed it necessary to move - doing a traffic stop on the Meeks vehicle. There was 4 citations written and there should've been 5. Add one for the officer's blatant OBSTRUCTION OF TRAFFIC FLOW. That is what started the whole thing......CPD arrogance.

[tardfarmer]

The thing that jumped out at me the most in that story is the Good Reverend Jackson's request that a new regulation be put into place requiring officers to keep their guns holstered during traffic stops. What a buffoon. What an idiot.

I have a better one for you, here in Milwaukee about a month ago a drunk illegal was driving on the freeway and decided to follow some black guy and have at him. The black guy did some evasive maneuvers to lose the turd, pulled over into a sideroad and the illegal tried to run him over (leaving the guys clothing stuck to the front of the car that almost killed him). Well the illegal got out of his car and reached for something (after trying to kill the other driver).

He got 8 rounds in his greasy hide -- the black guy was an off duty Milwaukee cop.

Now they say that off duty cops have to carry badges for those that don't "speak english"...

Screw 'em I say.

Officer Glover is my hero.