338-06 or 338WM?
05-17-2015, 07:35 AM
#11
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Allegan, MI
Posts: 8,019
To go from 06 to 338 Win isn't as simple as just replacing the barrel. You need to change the bolt too since the base dimensions of the 2 cartridges are different. I was going to turn an old 7mm Mag into an 06 and the gunsmiths all told me the bolt needs replaced too. he 338 Win base is the same size as the 7mm Mag base so you would end up with the same problem.
I'd suggest going to the 9.3x62 Mauser instead. The base of both the 06 and the 9.2 are the same and the 9.3 is a great round that has been around for well over 100 years and is very, very popular in Europe and Africa. You can get heavier bullets in the 9.3 than you can the 338.
I'd suggest going to the 9.3x62 Mauser instead. The base of both the 06 and the 9.2 are the same and the 9.3 is a great round that has been around for well over 100 years and is very, very popular in Europe and Africa. You can get heavier bullets in the 9.3 than you can the 338.
05-17-2015, 07:49 AM
#12
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,230
Replacing the barrel will only work it the replacement barrel is chambered for a round with the same base diameter or he'll end up with feeding issues which means the 338 Win Mag is a no go. And, the 9.3x62 Mauser is a much better round than the 338-06 and it has the same base diameter. Matter of fact you can make 9.3x62 brass from 30-06 brass in a pinch. So, if he wants a bigger round than the 06 on the same rifle and the same bolt, in my opinion, he is better served by the Mauser round. But that is merely my opinion however it is based on seeing the 9.3x62 used in the field an awful lot. Most Americans are unfamiliar with the round which is a shame because it is a great round and has been widely used for everything up to and including Cape Buffalo and Elephant, something the 338-06 can't claim.
Last edited by flags; 05-17-2015 at 07:53 AM.
05-17-2015, 08:46 AM
#13
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Allegan, MI
Posts: 8,019
Wrong. Go back and read his original post. He clearly states: So then I got to thinking - why not just buy an extra barrel for my '06? Then I could change out in a matter of hours, and only have about $500 invested, instead of another ~$2000 in a rifle and optic.
Replacing the barrel will only work it the replacement barrel is chambered for a round with the same base diameter or he'll end up with feeding issues which means the 338 Win Mag is a no go. And, the 9.3x62 Mauser is a much better round than the 338-06 and it has the same base diameter. Matter of fact you can make 9.3x62 brass from 30-06 brass in a pinch. So, if he wants a bigger round than the 06 on the same rifle and the same bolt, in my opinion, he is better served by the Mauser round. But that is merely my opinion however it is based on seeing the 9.3x62 used in the field an awful lot. Most Americans are unfamiliar with the round which is a shame because it is a great round and has been widely used for everything up to and including Cape Buffalo and Elephant, something the 338-06 can't claim.
Replacing the barrel will only work it the replacement barrel is chambered for a round with the same base diameter or he'll end up with feeding issues which means the 338 Win Mag is a no go. And, the 9.3x62 Mauser is a much better round than the 338-06 and it has the same base diameter. Matter of fact you can make 9.3x62 brass from 30-06 brass in a pinch. So, if he wants a bigger round than the 06 on the same rifle and the same bolt, in my opinion, he is better served by the Mauser round. But that is merely my opinion however it is based on seeing the 9.3x62 used in the field an awful lot. Most Americans are unfamiliar with the round which is a shame because it is a great round and has been widely used for everything up to and including Cape Buffalo and Elephant, something the 338-06 can't claim.
Last edited by Topgun 3006; 05-17-2015 at 09:02 AM. Reason: Spelling
05-17-2015, 11:04 AM
#14
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,902
Sorry again for the confusion, my original post on this thread wasn't very clear. The question was only meant to compare the 338-06 and the 338wm cartridges, and my intent is, and has always been, if I went with the 338-06, to convert my old .30-06 to a switch barrel, or if I went with the 338wm, to build a new rifle. Never any intent to convert my old .30-06 to a 338wm.
When I came to post this thread, I was still on the fence as to whether to drop $2000 on a new rifle in 338wm, or simply add a 338 A-square barrel to my 30-06 for around $500. But in the interest of avoiding the financial discussion - since I know I'll spend the money on the "right rig" regardless of the 4x multiplier - but rather wanted only to focus on the cartridges themselves.
Since then, I bought a 338wm rifle, a 338wm barrel for a 7mm rifle to be a switch rig, and a 338-06 barrel for my 30-06, so I don't have to choose.
I've done the "changing cartridge family" conversion deal before, and in certain platforms, it's not really that difficult. For Remington and Savages, spare bolts/boltheads, mag boxes, followers, etc are easy to find. For the Ruger's that I'm building upon right now, spare bolts are like hens teeth, so it's a non-starter. On the other hand, I have a set-up for one of my wife's rifles to swap between 223rem and 243win, only takes about an hour and a half, and all of the parts were available off the shelf at Midway. At the end of the day, it's not that hard to swap families, but that wasn't my goal for this set of projects.
One particular disadvantage of the 338-06, but not a show stopper, and equally if I were making 9.3x62mm brass from .30-06 brass, is that the headstamp on imported ammo has to match the chamber marking of the accompanying rifle. So I'd have to spend the money on brass with proper headstamps if I intended to take this particular rig overseas. Not a show stopper, as Norma, Nosler, and Wby all make 338-06 stamped brass, but it's still an extra hassle.
Part of my motivation for the 30-06/338 A-square switch rig is that I'll be passing that rifle - my first deer rifle - down to my son in a few years. I was basically at a crossroads where it doesn't shoot well anymore, to the point I wouldn't be proud to pass it down, and I wouldn't expect my son to be proud to receive it. I had the choice to either scrap my old rifle, or rebuild it into something my son can be proud to shoot. At the same time, my wife and I settled on a pair of Ruger stainless actions to have our own switch barrel rigs. So now my son, my wife, and I (when he's old enough) will have switch barrel rigs suitable for hunting whitetails here at home, plus an extra tube suitable for much larger game, should the rare need arise. 30-06/338-06, 7mmRM/338wm, and 300wm/458wm.
When I came to post this thread, I was still on the fence as to whether to drop $2000 on a new rifle in 338wm, or simply add a 338 A-square barrel to my 30-06 for around $500. But in the interest of avoiding the financial discussion - since I know I'll spend the money on the "right rig" regardless of the 4x multiplier - but rather wanted only to focus on the cartridges themselves.
Since then, I bought a 338wm rifle, a 338wm barrel for a 7mm rifle to be a switch rig, and a 338-06 barrel for my 30-06, so I don't have to choose.
I've done the "changing cartridge family" conversion deal before, and in certain platforms, it's not really that difficult. For Remington and Savages, spare bolts/boltheads, mag boxes, followers, etc are easy to find. For the Ruger's that I'm building upon right now, spare bolts are like hens teeth, so it's a non-starter. On the other hand, I have a set-up for one of my wife's rifles to swap between 223rem and 243win, only takes about an hour and a half, and all of the parts were available off the shelf at Midway. At the end of the day, it's not that hard to swap families, but that wasn't my goal for this set of projects.
One particular disadvantage of the 338-06, but not a show stopper, and equally if I were making 9.3x62mm brass from .30-06 brass, is that the headstamp on imported ammo has to match the chamber marking of the accompanying rifle. So I'd have to spend the money on brass with proper headstamps if I intended to take this particular rig overseas. Not a show stopper, as Norma, Nosler, and Wby all make 338-06 stamped brass, but it's still an extra hassle.
Part of my motivation for the 30-06/338 A-square switch rig is that I'll be passing that rifle - my first deer rifle - down to my son in a few years. I was basically at a crossroads where it doesn't shoot well anymore, to the point I wouldn't be proud to pass it down, and I wouldn't expect my son to be proud to receive it. I had the choice to either scrap my old rifle, or rebuild it into something my son can be proud to shoot. At the same time, my wife and I settled on a pair of Ruger stainless actions to have our own switch barrel rigs. So now my son, my wife, and I (when he's old enough) will have switch barrel rigs suitable for hunting whitetails here at home, plus an extra tube suitable for much larger game, should the rare need arise. 30-06/338-06, 7mmRM/338wm, and 300wm/458wm.
05-17-2015, 05:12 PM
#15
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Eastern wv
Posts: 3,644
Sorry again for the confusion, my original post on this thread wasn't very clear. The question was only meant to compare the 338-06 and the 338wm cartridges, and my intent is, and has always been, if I went with the 338-06, to convert my old .30-06 to a switch barrel, or if I went with the 338wm, to build a new rifle. Never any intent to convert my old .30-06 to a 338wm.
When I came to post this thread, I was still on the fence as to whether to drop $2000 on a new rifle in 338wm, or simply add a 338 A-square barrel to my 30-06 for around $500. But in the interest of avoiding the financial discussion - since I know I'll spend the money on the "right rig" regardless of the 4x multiplier - but rather wanted only to focus on the cartridges themselves.
Since then, I bought a 338wm rifle, a 338wm barrel for a 7mm rifle to be a switch rig, and a 338-06 barrel for my 30-06, so I don't have to choose.
I've done the "changing cartridge family" conversion deal before, and in certain platforms, it's not really that difficult. For Remington and Savages, spare bolts/boltheads, mag boxes, followers, etc are easy to find. For the Ruger's that I'm building upon right now, spare bolts are like hens teeth, so it's a non-starter. On the other hand, I have a set-up for one of my wife's rifles to swap between 223rem and 243win, only takes about an hour and a half, and all of the parts were available off the shelf at Midway. At the end of the day, it's not that hard to swap families, but that wasn't my goal for this set of projects.
One particular disadvantage of the 338-06, but not a show stopper, and equally if I were making 9.3x62mm brass from .30-06 brass, is that the headstamp on imported ammo has to match the chamber marking of the accompanying rifle. So I'd have to spend the money on brass with proper headstamps if I intended to take this particular rig overseas. Not a show stopper, as Norma, Nosler, and Wby all make 338-06 stamped brass, but it's still an extra hassle.
Part of my motivation for the 30-06/338 A-square switch rig is that I'll be passing that rifle - my first deer rifle - down to my son in a few years. I was basically at a crossroads where it doesn't shoot well anymore, to the point I wouldn't be proud to pass it down, and I wouldn't expect my son to be proud to receive it. I had the choice to either scrap my old rifle, or rebuild it into something my son can be proud to shoot. At the same time, my wife and I settled on a pair of Ruger stainless actions to have our own switch barrel rigs. So now my son, my wife, and I (when he's old enough) will have switch barrel rigs suitable for hunting whitetails here at home, plus an extra tube suitable for much larger game, should the rare need arise. 30-06/338-06, 7mmRM/338wm, and 300wm/458wm.
When I came to post this thread, I was still on the fence as to whether to drop $2000 on a new rifle in 338wm, or simply add a 338 A-square barrel to my 30-06 for around $500. But in the interest of avoiding the financial discussion - since I know I'll spend the money on the "right rig" regardless of the 4x multiplier - but rather wanted only to focus on the cartridges themselves.
Since then, I bought a 338wm rifle, a 338wm barrel for a 7mm rifle to be a switch rig, and a 338-06 barrel for my 30-06, so I don't have to choose.
I've done the "changing cartridge family" conversion deal before, and in certain platforms, it's not really that difficult. For Remington and Savages, spare bolts/boltheads, mag boxes, followers, etc are easy to find. For the Ruger's that I'm building upon right now, spare bolts are like hens teeth, so it's a non-starter. On the other hand, I have a set-up for one of my wife's rifles to swap between 223rem and 243win, only takes about an hour and a half, and all of the parts were available off the shelf at Midway. At the end of the day, it's not that hard to swap families, but that wasn't my goal for this set of projects.
One particular disadvantage of the 338-06, but not a show stopper, and equally if I were making 9.3x62mm brass from .30-06 brass, is that the headstamp on imported ammo has to match the chamber marking of the accompanying rifle. So I'd have to spend the money on brass with proper headstamps if I intended to take this particular rig overseas. Not a show stopper, as Norma, Nosler, and Wby all make 338-06 stamped brass, but it's still an extra hassle.
Part of my motivation for the 30-06/338 A-square switch rig is that I'll be passing that rifle - my first deer rifle - down to my son in a few years. I was basically at a crossroads where it doesn't shoot well anymore, to the point I wouldn't be proud to pass it down, and I wouldn't expect my son to be proud to receive it. I had the choice to either scrap my old rifle, or rebuild it into something my son can be proud to shoot. At the same time, my wife and I settled on a pair of Ruger stainless actions to have our own switch barrel rigs. So now my son, my wife, and I (when he's old enough) will have switch barrel rigs suitable for hunting whitetails here at home, plus an extra tube suitable for much larger game, should the rare need arise. 30-06/338-06, 7mmRM/338wm, and 300wm/458wm.
RR
05-18-2015, 01:30 AM
#16
Spike
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 7
Since this original posting, I've actually made up my mind and spent some money. I decided that I do indeed need another 338wm, AND to go ahead with converting my 30-06 to a 30-06 + 338-06 Switch rig. I was placing an order for a handful of barrels, so I took advantage of the volume discount and bought as many as I thought I could use. They're all supposed to be here in late June or July, and the end result will be 3 switch barrel rifle rigs - 30-06/338-06, 7mmRM/338wm, and 300wm/458wm - plus a 416 Rigby single-tuber. I spent a little too much this winter on a couple revolver projects, plus a couple new AR's for me and the missus, then a couple of exhibition grade stock blanks, so the barrels will sit around for a few months collecting dust before they get spun onto the receivers.
To clarify what I was asking about in this post, again, I wasn't ever considering a comparison of the 338wm vs. the 30-06. I've owned both (and since this originally aired - I own a 338WM again), and have killed game with both. My question was more a casual "convince me I'm not crazy for wanting a 338-06 too".
I'm not really a fan of the lightweight bullets in the 338wm, nor of superweight pills in the 30-06 or 300wm, hence my desire for different cartridges for their respective applications. At the end of the day, I know I CAN DO a lot of things with my reloading press, but I also know there are only a few things that I WANT TO DO. There are disadvantages of running 160grn 338wm rounds just like there are disadvantages to running 220grn 30-06 loads. I'm a type that leans towards selecting the most desirable bullet weight for a given bore diameter.
Luckily for me, I'm financially irresponsible enough to blow any spare dollars I can scrounge up on rifles, so I'm not stuck with just one or two rifle cartridges in my safe - heck, I'm glad I'm not limited to a dozen cartridges, let alone a few!
To clarify what I was asking about in this post, again, I wasn't ever considering a comparison of the 338wm vs. the 30-06. I've owned both (and since this originally aired - I own a 338WM again), and have killed game with both. My question was more a casual "convince me I'm not crazy for wanting a 338-06 too".
I'm not really a fan of the lightweight bullets in the 338wm, nor of superweight pills in the 30-06 or 300wm, hence my desire for different cartridges for their respective applications. At the end of the day, I know I CAN DO a lot of things with my reloading press, but I also know there are only a few things that I WANT TO DO. There are disadvantages of running 160grn 338wm rounds just like there are disadvantages to running 220grn 30-06 loads. I'm a type that leans towards selecting the most desirable bullet weight for a given bore diameter.
Luckily for me, I'm financially irresponsible enough to blow any spare dollars I can scrounge up on rifles, so I'm not stuck with just one or two rifle cartridges in my safe - heck, I'm glad I'm not limited to a dozen cartridges, let alone a few!
Nomercy, I understand u better now...& Thx yes..but imhv,indeed, how will one go about, 1st'ly, re the actual switching of the barrels in these 3 rigs ?..will u do it yourself or not, or will g-smith help(before the trip ?) ?..therefor then,it probably won't/can't be a quick-switching job at the home/in the bush ?...ie, for myself I do foresee problems with adjusting headspace, etc, every time a barrel is switched, so, if I were in your shoes I'd carefully consider this aspect..& depending on yr own circumstances..
Fortunately I see tht the measurements of the back of the diff calibre-shells will not influence swopping the bolt..& these 3 rigs are nicely balanced, as well, again imho..
Pl do not get me wrong, u yo-self may not have prob's in these regards, but, myself being in your shoes will definitely be hard-pressed..
& yes, here we occasional-hunters are being limited to 1, 2 or 3 rifles(fire-arms) by LAW, lack of money/resources doesn't even come into play..iow, we have to carefully/properly motivate each & every F-arm/barrel application to the authorities EVERYTIME, & therefor,
alternatively, some(many) alternate loads needs to be developed for one & same rifle..& if there is a switch-barrel involved, BOTH/each, the barrels must be properly motivated & licensed..
It is not expected tht your local laws/regulations to be so draconian yet, though..
Any event.. Enjoy & keep us informed ?
app
05-18-2015, 01:38 AM
#17
Spike
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 7
Flaggs...I may be wrong, but it seems to me tht the measurements of ALL 3 the mentioned rigs are ok ?(for each barrel-swap-rig)..
Nom may possibly have some problems with adjusting headspace depending on how he goes about it, naturally..but he may probably get used to such as well...
I can only wish him ALL OF THE BEST !!
Regards
app
Nom may possibly have some problems with adjusting headspace depending on how he goes about it, naturally..but he may probably get used to such as well...
I can only wish him ALL OF THE BEST !!
Regards
app
05-18-2015, 12:30 PM
#18
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Eastern wv
Posts: 3,644
with the proper tools, the proper knowledge, and use of go/no go gauges, setting the headspace is no big deal, after they are in use, you could use a resized case for the go guage, or a loaded round for that matter.
RR
RR
05-18-2015, 04:18 PM
#19
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,902
[Y]es, here we occasional-hunters are being limited to 1, 2 or 3 rifles(fire-arms) by LAW, lack of money/resources doesn't even come into play..iow, we have to carefully/properly motivate each & every F-arm/barrel application to the authorities EVERYTIME, & therefor,
alternatively, some(many) alternate loads needs to be developed for one & same rifle..& if there is a switch-barrel involved, BOTH/each, the barrels must be properly motivated & licensed..
It is not expected tht your local laws/regulations to be so draconian yet, though..
Any event.. Enjoy & keep us informed ?
app
alternatively, some(many) alternate loads needs to be developed for one & same rifle..& if there is a switch-barrel involved, BOTH/each, the barrels must be properly motivated & licensed..
It is not expected tht your local laws/regulations to be so draconian yet, though..
Any event.. Enjoy & keep us informed ?
app
[H]ow will one go about, 1st'ly, re the actual switching of the barrels in these 3 rigs ?..will u do it yourself or not, or will g-smith help(before the trip ?) ?..therefor then,it probably won't/can't be a quick-switching job at the home/in the bush ?...ie, for myself I do foresee problems with adjusting headspace, etc, every time a barrel is switched, so, if I were in your shoes I'd carefully consider this aspect..& depending on yr own circumstances..
Fortunately I see tht the measurements of the back of the diff calibre-shells will not influence swopping the bolt..& these 3 rigs are nicely balanced, as well, again imho..
Pl do not get me wrong, u yo-self may not have prob's in these regards, but, myself being in your shoes will definitely be hard-pressed..
Fortunately I see tht the measurements of the back of the diff calibre-shells will not influence swopping the bolt..& these 3 rigs are nicely balanced, as well, again imho..
Pl do not get me wrong, u yo-self may not have prob's in these regards, but, myself being in your shoes will definitely be hard-pressed..
As for how I'll set headspace: I've ordered the barrels short chambered, such that I'll do the finish reaming to set headspace myself. I own a set of 30-06 roughing and finish reamers, finish reamers for 300wm and 458 win mag (and Lott), and I'll be renting the rest to cut down on my investment.
As for how I'll switch the barrels back and forth: I will do so myself, which takes under an hour at a leisurely pace. For rigs that share a common cartridge family and OAL, just remove the stock, fix the action in a vise, crank off the first barrel, crank on the other one, check headspace, replace the stock, and rezero the optic. For more complicated cartridge swaps outside of the same cartridge family, you additionally have to replace the mag box (feed lips), follower assembly, and the bolt/bolthead. At a "slightly faster than leisurely pace," I can still switch between 223rem and 243win in my wife's Savage in under an hour.
As for how to sustain headspace: In my experience, once you set the threads by torquing and retorquing a few times, as long as you install the barrels to the same torque specification each time, they will retain headspace. I also include witness marks for alignment on the bottom of the barrel and receiver (and recoil lug in the case of sandwich style lugs). I buy the headspace go and no-go gauges for all of my switch rigs, but as Ridge Runner mentioned, that's really just extra expense - a cartridge case or even loaded cartridge of proper headspace can be used. In lieu of a no-go gauge, I've added shims to the base (or even just tape) of my go-gauge to act as a no-go gauge. These days, I just buy the gauges.
I can understand that most folks consider that level of "gunsmithing" to be over their heads, but the reality is that it's just a matter of screwing a male threaded barrel into a female threaded receiver - just like a lightbulb.
