Some may remember from awhile back I had posted a question about an 1891 Mauser Argentine, anyway, I was browsing Sportsmansguide looking at scopes for my .22 (see my other post) and I decided to take a look at more accesories for it. I didn't find anything for my .22 but I did see they had .308 barrels for the 98 Mausers. Being that my Mauser shoots 7.65 which is rather expensive, is a barrel swap possible? If it is possible and I did decide to convert my Argentine into a .308, what else would have to be changed on the gun? I thank you all in advance!
__________________ "Respect is more than knowing where the deer's brains, guts, and heart are. It's acknowledging the fact he possess all three"
Parker Buck Hunter
HHA Infringer Sight
Easton St Epic 340
Tight Point Shuttle T-Lock 125
Well, for what it would cost for a barrel, you COULD begin to reload the 7.65X53mm..... Then it wouldn't cost so much to shoot it. I have made 7.65X53mm cases for my M1909 Arg. from 7.62 NATO brass (you have to expand the necks up to 8mm or .338", then size them back down, leaving a "false shoulder" for correct headspacing while fire-forming, since the 7.65 is longer in head-to-shoulder dimension than the .308.) It comes out 2mm short, but that's of little consequence.........
Will M98 barrels fitthe M1891 Arg. receiver?
IF you convert to .308, there might be little change required other than the barrel. The two cartridges are very similar, except that the .308 is fatter at the shoulder. You could try running some dummy .308's through the action to see if they fit the magazine OK.... (The standard .308 operates at pressureshigher than the M1891 action was designed for. You might have to use reduced loads. Then you'd be back to a handloading proposition.
Another alternative to rebarrelling would be to use the present barrel, have it cut off two or three threads at the breech, rethreaded, and rechambered for the .308 case. I shoot .308" BULLETS in my M1909 (from 7.65X53mm cases), and they are very accurate.
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Ok, so its possible to rebarrel to a 308, though the receiver probably wouldn't be able to handle the pressure. The other option comes down to handloading, which I suspected would be the case anyway. I've toyed with the idea of handloading for awhile and I have a family friend who has everything I need to do it I believe. This I think may be the right way to go, as nice as it would be to just use a standard 308 out of the box, it's probably not too safe it sounds.
One book I have on the subject says that I should use .303 cal bullets if I reload but also says that the .308 will work, but can cause the grooves to wear out faster. Have you experienced this at all? Have you tried .303 bullets at all?
Thanks for the response eldeguello
__________________ "Respect is more than knowing where the deer's brains, guts, and heart are. It's acknowledging the fact he possess all three"
Parker Buck Hunter
HHA Infringer Sight
Easton St Epic 340
Tight Point Shuttle T-Lock 125
I didn't find anything for my .22 but I did see they had .308 barrels for the 98 Mausers. Being that my Mauser shoots 7.65 which is rather expensive, is a barrel swap possible?
No, a 98 barrel will not fit a 1891 receiver, you need a barrel threaded for a small ring mauser.
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I didn't find anything for my .22 but I did see they had .308 barrels for the 98 Mausers. Being that my Mauser shoots 7.65 which is rather expensive, is a barrel swap possible?
No, a 98 barrel will not fit a 1891 receiver, you need a barrel threaded for a small ring mauser.
Ok, thank you, that scratches that option off. Out of curiousity, does anyone know a good place to look for one online? Say hypothetically I found a 7.62 barrel for a small ring mauser, would that be shootable without major changes?
__________________ "Respect is more than knowing where the deer's brains, guts, and heart are. It's acknowledging the fact he possess all three"
Parker Buck Hunter
HHA Infringer Sight
Easton St Epic 340
Tight Point Shuttle T-Lock 125
It would be shootable, but you would still need to reload and reduce the loads for .308. The action on a 1891 isn't made to handle .308 pressures.
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The 7.62X51 and .308 Win are one and the same.Just get a set of dies for what you have and load them is probably the most practical route.If you make them from .308 brass as advised it should be cheap enough........Harold
"The standard .308 operates at pressureshigher than the M1891 action was designed for. You might have to use reduced loads. Then you'd be back to a handloading proposition."
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ORIGINAL: Austin/WI
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ORIGINAL: Briman
It would be shootable, but you would still need to reload and reduce the loads for .308. The action on a 1891 isn't made to handle .308 pressures.
So I assume it wouldn't be able to handle the 7.62 as well? Thanks for the help!
Here's what you are looking at: The 7.62 NATO and Factoiry .308 Win. ammo are loaded to 50-52,000 PSI standard. The Argentine M1891 was SUPPOSEDLY designed to use ammo developing 40-45,000 PSI. There are other rifles, such as the M1896 Swedish ("small-ring") Mauser that were designed for the same range of pressures. Some of these have been rebarreled to .243 and .308-based calibers, and have NOT had any serious problems! So it is entirely possible that you could do the same, and get away with it. BUT, where the rub comes is that no-one could GUARANTEE the safety of such a conversion, so a responsible gunsmith would have to recommend AGAINST doing it, and would be likelyto refuse to do the work, due to potential liability issues.
P.O. Ackley, in Vol. 1 of his Handbook for Shooters & Reloaders, recommends leaving the 1891's in their original caliber, but does state that the "actions are relatively strong", (whatever that means!!) He shows a load using a 150-grain bullet and 50 grains of IMR 4350 giving 2630 FPS, which looks pretty safe in a 1891 to me. That's a little slower than the 308, but is operating at less than 45,000 PSI, too! In addition he shows one 180-grain load that developes over 2400 FPS, no doubt adequate for any North American game except Kodiak bear!
IF I had the rifle, I'd get a set of 7.65X53mm dies, and reload for it. I do reload for my M1909 in the same caliber, BUT due to it having a more modern M98-type action, I have not limited my loads to M1891 levels......
__________________
"Bitte, trinks du das Wasser nicht. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen."
Just to throw a monkey wrench in this whole deal. There are a # of small ring barrel/calibers you could change to, one of them being a 300 savage. I my self would go to a 7 x 57 (7 mm mauser) or a 35 rem. But I am a big fan of the 7 x 57 (I've only got 3) and feel it's an excelent choice for deer size game and ammo is availble on line or in a select few gun shops. If I did a barrel change I would put a bold trigger on it (just a lot nice trigger) then a new stock, and still just have a pigs ear. But it's sort of cool to go to the range with an old beat up mauser and out shoot some of the newer stuff, good luck with your desicion.
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Mauser Question
