Lehigh 265grn Prototype worked today!!
10-15-2016, 06:38 PM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Saxonburg Pa
Posts: 3,925
Lehigh 265grn Prototype worked today!!
Today was the first day of a early muzzleloader season here in PA. I should mention its Doe only. I haven't done any bow hunting yet so it was nice to get out this morning. I had this bullet loaded with 120grns of BH209 by volume and a harvester short black sabot. The gun I used was the T/C strike topped with a Nikon Omega and Winchester primer.
I saw a lot of Doe this morning and every time I saw them it was a mother and fawn and sometimes two fawns. This never stopped me in prior years I would shoot Mom and head home. I guess the older I get I just don't wanna do that anymore. I saw 22 Deer in the first hour of the morning. But no mature Doe's alone. About 1 hour after daylight everything quit moving. At right around 2 hours after daylight one alone mature Doe came out about 50 yards in front of me milling around. I waited 5 minutes in case fawns came out before shooting. I waited till the Doe turned towards me. I really wanted to test penetration and performance. The bullet went in just right of the right shoulder and exited right before the rear leg. The bullet traveled along way thru the Deer. And the results were what I expected. The bullet hit so hard it went spread eagle and smashed her chin off the ground. No kicking or moving around at all. I mean dead is an understatement. This bullet does seem extremely over kill for Deer but that's ok. My lighter bullets will be done for later in the year. So the first test in the field went extremely well and I look forward to more. I did find two petals when gutting it and a pretty good size exit hole as well.
I saw a lot of Doe this morning and every time I saw them it was a mother and fawn and sometimes two fawns. This never stopped me in prior years I would shoot Mom and head home. I guess the older I get I just don't wanna do that anymore. I saw 22 Deer in the first hour of the morning. But no mature Doe's alone. About 1 hour after daylight everything quit moving. At right around 2 hours after daylight one alone mature Doe came out about 50 yards in front of me milling around. I waited 5 minutes in case fawns came out before shooting. I waited till the Doe turned towards me. I really wanted to test penetration and performance. The bullet went in just right of the right shoulder and exited right before the rear leg. The bullet traveled along way thru the Deer. And the results were what I expected. The bullet hit so hard it went spread eagle and smashed her chin off the ground. No kicking or moving around at all. I mean dead is an understatement. This bullet does seem extremely over kill for Deer but that's ok. My lighter bullets will be done for later in the year. So the first test in the field went extremely well and I look forward to more. I did find two petals when gutting it and a pretty good size exit hole as well.
10-15-2016, 07:10 PM
#2
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
First off congratulations on the doe. Second, I like your sportsmanship. I always look for does that have no fawns. And that bullet must have really hammered her. Although with that kind of powder charge it must have had a lot of velocity. A good test. And I agree, there is never too much bullet for a deer. Congratulations again.
10-17-2016, 07:08 AM
#5
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: River Ridge, LA (Suburb of New Orleans)
Posts: 10,917
Regarding does with fawns. Biologist say that so long as the fawns are beyond the spot stage they will do just fine without the doe. Actually, they may do better after being separated from the doe.
Here's a summary of the findings in a study by Dr. Stefan Holzenbein and Dr. Larry Marchinton at the University of Georgia.
After placing radio collars on 34-buck fawns, the mothers for 15 of the fawns were caught and released 20 miles away in order to orphan those 15 fawns. The remaining 19-buck fawns were left with their mothers.
The scientist tracked the movements and death rates of the buck fawns for two years and found only 9% of the orphaned bucks moved to new areas and over 85% of bucks left with their mothers moved to new areas. Most of this movement happened during the fawning season and the rut. They concluded that the mothers forced the buck fawns to disperse to reduce inbreeding.
They also found that orphaned bucks lived longer. Only 55% of orphaned bucks died during the study while over 90% of bucks left with their mothers died. Starvation and predators caused most deaths.
The scientists felt that orphaned bucks lived longer because they were able to stay home while non-orphaned bucks were forced into unfamiliar areas (usually 2-6 miles away) where more deaths took place. These bucks did not know the escape routes and best places to find food so more died.
So, by killing does with buck fawns you increase the odds the bucks will stay in your hunting area and increase the odds they will survive into the next year.
Here's a summary of the findings in a study by Dr. Stefan Holzenbein and Dr. Larry Marchinton at the University of Georgia.
After placing radio collars on 34-buck fawns, the mothers for 15 of the fawns were caught and released 20 miles away in order to orphan those 15 fawns. The remaining 19-buck fawns were left with their mothers.
The scientist tracked the movements and death rates of the buck fawns for two years and found only 9% of the orphaned bucks moved to new areas and over 85% of bucks left with their mothers moved to new areas. Most of this movement happened during the fawning season and the rut. They concluded that the mothers forced the buck fawns to disperse to reduce inbreeding.
They also found that orphaned bucks lived longer. Only 55% of orphaned bucks died during the study while over 90% of bucks left with their mothers died. Starvation and predators caused most deaths.
The scientists felt that orphaned bucks lived longer because they were able to stay home while non-orphaned bucks were forced into unfamiliar areas (usually 2-6 miles away) where more deaths took place. These bucks did not know the escape routes and best places to find food so more died.
So, by killing does with buck fawns you increase the odds the bucks will stay in your hunting area and increase the odds they will survive into the next year.
10-17-2016, 11:40 AM
#6
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Saxonburg Pa
Posts: 3,925
Regarding does with fawns. Biologist say that so long as the fawns are beyond the spot stage they will do just fine without the doe. Actually, they may do better after being separated from the doe.
Here's a summary of the findings in a study by Dr. Stefan Holzenbein and Dr. Larry Marchinton at the University of Georgia.
After placing radio collars on 34-buck fawns, the mothers for 15 of the fawns were caught and released 20 miles away in order to orphan those 15 fawns. The remaining 19-buck fawns were left with their mothers.
The scientist tracked the movements and death rates of the buck fawns for two years and found only 9% of the orphaned bucks moved to new areas and over 85% of bucks left with their mothers moved to new areas. Most of this movement happened during the fawning season and the rut. They concluded that the mothers forced the buck fawns to disperse to reduce inbreeding.
They also found that orphaned bucks lived longer. Only 55% of orphaned bucks died during the study while over 90% of bucks left with their mothers died. Starvation and predators caused most deaths.
The scientists felt that orphaned bucks lived longer because they were able to stay home while non-orphaned bucks were forced into unfamiliar areas (usually 2-6 miles away) where more deaths took place. These bucks did not know the escape routes and best places to find food so more died.
So, by killing does with buck fawns you increase the odds the bucks will stay in your hunting area and increase the odds they will survive into the next year.
Here's a summary of the findings in a study by Dr. Stefan Holzenbein and Dr. Larry Marchinton at the University of Georgia.
After placing radio collars on 34-buck fawns, the mothers for 15 of the fawns were caught and released 20 miles away in order to orphan those 15 fawns. The remaining 19-buck fawns were left with their mothers.
The scientist tracked the movements and death rates of the buck fawns for two years and found only 9% of the orphaned bucks moved to new areas and over 85% of bucks left with their mothers moved to new areas. Most of this movement happened during the fawning season and the rut. They concluded that the mothers forced the buck fawns to disperse to reduce inbreeding.
They also found that orphaned bucks lived longer. Only 55% of orphaned bucks died during the study while over 90% of bucks left with their mothers died. Starvation and predators caused most deaths.
The scientists felt that orphaned bucks lived longer because they were able to stay home while non-orphaned bucks were forced into unfamiliar areas (usually 2-6 miles away) where more deaths took place. These bucks did not know the escape routes and best places to find food so more died.
So, by killing does with buck fawns you increase the odds the bucks will stay in your hunting area and increase the odds they will survive into the next year.
10-19-2016, 09:58 AM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Virginia / West Virginia
Posts: 4,906
Semi, I've always heard that too. But like Grouse, I guess I'm getting soft in my old age. Because I have alot of opportunities, I usually shoot does that don't have fawns. There was a time when I'd shoot the doe AND the fawns. 
10-19-2016, 11:30 AM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,834
Man!!!! And here I went and passed up 3 does this past week that had 5 fawns with them to only NOW find out that I could have let the grimreaper eat one more time!!!!!!!! Guess that's what I get for being fat n lazy!!!!! LMAO!!!!
10-19-2016, 12:09 PM
#9
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: River Ridge, LA (Suburb of New Orleans)
Posts: 10,917
What people think about which deer to kill and which to pass on can be upside down.
Recently I had an on-line conversation on the LA Sportsman web site about hunting club rules. This is what he posted.
And my comment.
Recently I had an on-line conversation on the LA Sportsman web site about hunting club rules. This is what he posted.
Copiah said: The club I'm in is close to easleyville/chipola area. It's mostly pine plantations and cut over (very little hardwoods except along creek bottoms,no surprise). But it's about 1800 acres with 18 members on it. We are shooting 4pt or better as a first buck, then 6pt or better for a second buck and 2 does per membership. Seem to be getting a few deer on camera but a lot of hogs in the area. Hopefully as we stop feeding some, they should relocate.
If I may make a suggestion Copiah. Those 4, 5 and 6 pointers you guys allow as a first buck are likely 1-1/2 year old deer - the same age as your spikes. But they are the better quality deer in your 1-1/2 year old class. And they are likely about the same weight as the spikes with respect to shooting young bucks for meat.
It might be a good idea to add spikes to your 'first buck' rule, and encourage taking a spike or three pointer rather than the 4's, 5's and 6's, and change the rule to 7 points or better for the second buck. Do that and you'll likely see more eight-pointers in the future.
It might be a good idea to add spikes to your 'first buck' rule, and encourage taking a spike or three pointer rather than the 4's, 5's and 6's, and change the rule to 7 points or better for the second buck. Do that and you'll likely see more eight-pointers in the future.
