Testing the new Lehigh 40x200 Xtreme Penetrator
02-25-2015, 05:09 PM
#1
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Testing the new Lehigh 40x200 Xtreme Penetrator
As I had planned I was able to get out to the farm mid-morning to do some shooting using the new Lehigh Xtreme Penetrator Brass muzzleloader bullet.
I really should say when I first heard about this new bullet - even when the new bullet was a copper pistol bullet and I think GregK first posted about the new bullet. I was really not that interested or inclined to think a non expanding solid brass or even copper bullet would hold any interest for me. UNLESS, I was considering hunting 'dangerous game'. The 'BULLET' did get more of my attention when I looked on the new Lehigh Web Site and checked out the penetration and wound channel facts that were posted for the pistol bullets. I had/have been shooting regular hollow point pistol bullets in my Sigs - one a 357 sig and the a 40 S&W. I had taken great pains to make sure I was not using a 'Home Defense" type bullet in the pistols that I was carrying in the woods while ML hunting. I wanted a bullet for yotes, wolves, black bear, and maybe even a cougar we have them all. The 'XP' was really what I needed. But, as I gained knowledge about them I thought - maybe a ML bullet of that design just might work.
Cavitation - whom ever mentioned that in one of these threads really opened my eyes - then after reading about 'cavitation' on line and having the bullet in hand looking at the design of the cavities in the nose it started to make sense. So now I need to apologize to Lehigh Dave who told me the straight scoop in the first place.
Today was the first step in the process of testing and checking for me. It was just a straight forward shooting day - just shooting paper. Next I want to do some velocity testing and finally some 'cavitation' testing.
I took two of my 45's to the fame this morning. A normal Knight DISC Extreme with a slow 1-30 twist and a Knight Super DISC with a faster 1-20 twist. Both rifles were scoped one with a Bushnell Elite 3x9 and the other with a Leupold Ultimate Slam 3x9. In addition the Super DISC was set for a near zero at 200 yards for yote and wolf hunting, so it is 3+ inches high @ 100
I set up a target, I ranged from the target back to the pick-up to be 100 yards, and decided to shoot the Super DISC first. Grouse had already done this so I was pretty confident that shooting the 100 would be just fine with the bullet. The only differences were he was shooting BH with a Harvester sabot and I was shooting T7-2f with a MMP sabot. In our discussion Grouse said to be sure and shoot some light powder loads as he had not done that. And as some one else suggested with this bullet it opens up some very good options for soft recoiling loads for those that would like it that way. The bullet will function as designed down to 800 fps and still provide really good penetration. So that was included in the test.
I started shooting 120 grains of T7 and using a MMP light tan sabot...
I shot four shots with that load then started backing the powder load down to 110, 90, 70, and finally 60 grains of powder.
It wasn't the best day to shoot because of the wind... the wind always blows at the farm but today it seemed really hardy, quartering from right to left across the range.
Here is the target - I felt I did very well up until the last shot of the day, a 60 grain shot with absolutely no recoil but I still managed to pull it away from the group... Also at the end of the shoot when I ranged back to the target from the portable bench it read 92 yards... So I labeled the target that way.
92 yards to the target
I did shoot the second rifle, the DISC Extreme, but the 1-30 twist, but it would not stabilize the bullet. All 3 shots did tumble. The solution for that as it has been in the past will probably be a slightly shorter 40x185+/- gr. XP.
Hope this hold some interest for some of you...
I really should say when I first heard about this new bullet - even when the new bullet was a copper pistol bullet and I think GregK first posted about the new bullet. I was really not that interested or inclined to think a non expanding solid brass or even copper bullet would hold any interest for me. UNLESS, I was considering hunting 'dangerous game'. The 'BULLET' did get more of my attention when I looked on the new Lehigh Web Site and checked out the penetration and wound channel facts that were posted for the pistol bullets. I had/have been shooting regular hollow point pistol bullets in my Sigs - one a 357 sig and the a 40 S&W. I had taken great pains to make sure I was not using a 'Home Defense" type bullet in the pistols that I was carrying in the woods while ML hunting. I wanted a bullet for yotes, wolves, black bear, and maybe even a cougar we have them all. The 'XP' was really what I needed. But, as I gained knowledge about them I thought - maybe a ML bullet of that design just might work.
Cavitation - whom ever mentioned that in one of these threads really opened my eyes - then after reading about 'cavitation' on line and having the bullet in hand looking at the design of the cavities in the nose it started to make sense. So now I need to apologize to Lehigh Dave who told me the straight scoop in the first place.
Today was the first step in the process of testing and checking for me. It was just a straight forward shooting day - just shooting paper. Next I want to do some velocity testing and finally some 'cavitation' testing.
I took two of my 45's to the fame this morning. A normal Knight DISC Extreme with a slow 1-30 twist and a Knight Super DISC with a faster 1-20 twist. Both rifles were scoped one with a Bushnell Elite 3x9 and the other with a Leupold Ultimate Slam 3x9. In addition the Super DISC was set for a near zero at 200 yards for yote and wolf hunting, so it is 3+ inches high @ 100
I set up a target, I ranged from the target back to the pick-up to be 100 yards, and decided to shoot the Super DISC first. Grouse had already done this so I was pretty confident that shooting the 100 would be just fine with the bullet. The only differences were he was shooting BH with a Harvester sabot and I was shooting T7-2f with a MMP sabot. In our discussion Grouse said to be sure and shoot some light powder loads as he had not done that. And as some one else suggested with this bullet it opens up some very good options for soft recoiling loads for those that would like it that way. The bullet will function as designed down to 800 fps and still provide really good penetration. So that was included in the test.
I started shooting 120 grains of T7 and using a MMP light tan sabot...
I shot four shots with that load then started backing the powder load down to 110, 90, 70, and finally 60 grains of powder.
It wasn't the best day to shoot because of the wind... the wind always blows at the farm but today it seemed really hardy, quartering from right to left across the range.
Here is the target - I felt I did very well up until the last shot of the day, a 60 grain shot with absolutely no recoil but I still managed to pull it away from the group... Also at the end of the shoot when I ranged back to the target from the portable bench it read 92 yards... So I labeled the target that way.
92 yards to the target
I did shoot the second rifle, the DISC Extreme, but the 1-30 twist, but it would not stabilize the bullet. All 3 shots did tumble. The solution for that as it has been in the past will probably be a slightly shorter 40x185+/- gr. XP.
Hope this hold some interest for some of you...
Last edited by sabotloader; 02-25-2015 at 05:26 PM.
02-25-2015, 05:29 PM
#3
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
02-26-2015, 07:54 AM
#6
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
We are in spring like weather - when I was going to shoot yesterday I complained to Terry about being cool - it was 43* - Feb. 25 - unheard of.
I am so accustomed to the good weather it is drizzling here a little bit now - rain not snow - and I want to run to the farm to shoot 1/28 and that field will probably be muddy! So dang the rain!!!!
Last edited by sabotloader; 02-26-2015 at 07:56 AM.
02-26-2015, 09:01 AM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Clifton, VA
Posts: 1,101
Hoping you get decent results if and when you shoot with a 1:28 twist.
I am very happy shooting my Speer DeepCurls and occasional FPBs but this bullet has me intrigued enough that I might try them out in my .50 Disc Extreme. I don't think MMP makes a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet but am pretty sure Harvester does.
Any chance Lehigh will make these in a .44 or .45?
edit - MMP does make a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet, the blue HPH.
I am very happy shooting my Speer DeepCurls and occasional FPBs but this bullet has me intrigued enough that I might try them out in my .50 Disc Extreme. I don't think MMP makes a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet but am pretty sure Harvester does.
Any chance Lehigh will make these in a .44 or .45?
edit - MMP does make a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet, the blue HPH.
Last edited by hubby11; 02-26-2015 at 09:06 AM. Reason: new info
02-26-2015, 09:42 AM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,922
Harvester makes two, regular and crush rib.
The future Lehigh 230 grain 40-cal has perked my interest. I have plenty of 180-200 grain in 40-cal already. The only larger 40-cal I currently own is the 50/40 Precision Extreme Elite 260. So I'm looking to add-on to that larger segment, but at the same time, not spend my current 2nd option, Dead-Center-type money for it. The Exteme Elites were 75 cents a-piece. That fits my budget.
The future Lehigh 230 grain 40-cal has perked my interest. I have plenty of 180-200 grain in 40-cal already. The only larger 40-cal I currently own is the 50/40 Precision Extreme Elite 260. So I'm looking to add-on to that larger segment, but at the same time, not spend my current 2nd option, Dead-Center-type money for it. The Exteme Elites were 75 cents a-piece. That fits my budget.
Last edited by Triple Se7en; 02-26-2015 at 09:48 AM.
02-26-2015, 01:00 PM
#9
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Testing in a 1/28 Twist 50 cal Rifle.
After shooting yesterday, I still had that nagging thought - I wonder if these will shoot in a 1-28 twist rifle. So this morning I did return to the farm with a Knight DISC Elite in 50 cal. The weather was lousy, well not really as compared to a normal winter, but it was raining the field was a muddy mess. But I needed to know.
You can see in this pic with the target and muddy tracks in the background and how wet it is and really can not see the mud to the best effect - but believe Palouse mud being mostly clay is yicky stuff.
Back to business - I used the same materials that I had used the day before, but today I only shot three 80 grain loads and three 120 grain loads. Plus a change of sabots - I was shooting the MMP 40x50 Blue.
I popped three primers to semi foul the bore loaded up the first round and decided what-the-heck and shot it at the target. Followed that with 2 more 80 grain shots on the target. I was thinking if a 80 grain load through a 1-28 - that should really be a good test for stability. Looking through the scope at the target I really only saw 2 holes and one of them was bigger than normal. I feared the worst 'Tumbling' again. But I was positive I heard the bullet hit all three shots. So I walked out in the mud and checked - I did hit it 3 times but it was hard to tell and no tumble.
walked back and loaded up the hunting load 120 grains 3 shots basically the same results...
So it really appears to me that the bullet will stabilize in a 1-28 twist.
I am hoping to get out again tomorrow and maybe get some chrono times.
You can see in this pic with the target and muddy tracks in the background and how wet it is and really can not see the mud to the best effect - but believe Palouse mud being mostly clay is yicky stuff.
Back to business - I used the same materials that I had used the day before, but today I only shot three 80 grain loads and three 120 grain loads. Plus a change of sabots - I was shooting the MMP 40x50 Blue.
I popped three primers to semi foul the bore loaded up the first round and decided what-the-heck and shot it at the target. Followed that with 2 more 80 grain shots on the target. I was thinking if a 80 grain load through a 1-28 - that should really be a good test for stability. Looking through the scope at the target I really only saw 2 holes and one of them was bigger than normal. I feared the worst 'Tumbling' again. But I was positive I heard the bullet hit all three shots. So I walked out in the mud and checked - I did hit it 3 times but it was hard to tell and no tumble.
walked back and loaded up the hunting load 120 grains 3 shots basically the same results...
So it really appears to me that the bullet will stabilize in a 1-28 twist.
I am hoping to get out again tomorrow and maybe get some chrono times.
02-26-2015, 01:14 PM
#10
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Hoping you get decent results if and when you shoot with a 1:28 twist.
I am very happy shooting my Speer DeepCurls and occasional FPBs but this bullet has me intrigued enough that I might try them out in my .50 Disc Extreme. I don't think MMP makes a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet but am pretty sure Harvester does.
Any chance Lehigh will make these in a .44 or .45?
edit - MMP does make a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet, the blue HPH.
I am very happy shooting my Speer DeepCurls and occasional FPBs but this bullet has me intrigued enough that I might try them out in my .50 Disc Extreme. I don't think MMP makes a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet but am pretty sure Harvester does.
Any chance Lehigh will make these in a .44 or .45?
edit - MMP does make a .50cal sabot for a .40 cal bullet, the blue HPH.
I was told that Lehigh would eventually makes these ML bullets. They are hoping to have 4 of these available in the next 3 weeks. I think they were running some the .452x250 yesterday for testing.
XP - Xtreme Penetrator
.400 185gr
.400 200gr
.452 250gr
.452 275gr
CF - Controlled Fracture
.400 185gr
.400 230gr
.452 250gr
.452 275gr