I started off shooting this morning, temp around 80, with the 250 Bloodlines in the supplied MMP orange sabots. First shot fired did not hit paper at 100yds. I then loaded a 300gr Harvester PT and it hit paper. I then saw the Bloodline hole about 2" high off the target so I adjusted the scope and fired another. Scope adjustment again and I went to shoot for a group. First two hit about 2" apart. These shots I let the barrel cool pretty good. Waiting on the gun to cool I walked to the target. On the way back I found 3 of the MMP sabots laying on the ground. To me they look horrible! Petals blown off and the cups square. I switched to Harvester smooths and shot the 4 shot group pictured, 5min max cool down between shots. As you can see the Harvester sabot I found looks great. I do not consider 100gr BH209 a hefty charge so I do not even want to know what the sabots would look like with 110-120gr. I ran out of powder and shooting commenced. I will be sticking with Harvester!
I started off shooting this morning, temp around 80, with the 250 Bloodlines in the supplied MMP orange sabots. First shot fired did not hit paper at 100yds. I then loaded a 300gr Harvester PT and it hit paper. I then saw the Bloodline hole about 2" high off the target so I adjusted the scope and fired another. Scope adjustment again and I went to shoot for a group. First two hit about 2" apart. These shots I let the barrel cool pretty good. Waiting on the gun to cool I walked to the target. On the way back I found 3 of the MMP sabots laying on the ground. To me they look horrible! Petals blown off and the cups square. I switched to Harvester smooths and shot the 4 shot group pictured, 5min max cool down between shots. As you can see the Harvester sabot I found looks great. I do not consider 100gr BH209 a hefty charge so I do not even want to know what the sabots would look like with 110-120gr. I ran out of powder and shooting commenced. I will be sticking with Harvester!
Not much different than mine... Here are the sabots...
And here is the target from that day testing different 300 grain 458
The looks of a used sabot has always concerned me in the past - it took me some time to get past that, but the results on the targets became the final decision... + another big factor for me has become how they function in cold weather. Shooting them in the summer in the ambient temperatures that summer brings always has an effect...
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Keep on Shooting Muzzleloaders they are a Blast
Last edited by sabotloader; 08-02-2011 at 08:06 AM.
Omega 45, I live where it is very hot it was 109 degrees according to my little weather set up. I have problem shooting MMP sabots when its like this but when the weather changes and the chill comes right after the first muzzle loader season here the MMP comes into its own it does much better for me in cold weather so since the over and under 300 sabot I use when its warm to nasty hot and when the temperature gets under 65 I switch to MMP. Works for me.
Ive used both brands of sabots to over 2300fps with smokeless without a failure except one boattail. I knew it would likely fail.
I use both brands depending on load, sabot OD and bullet OD/length/weight. Ive actually blown more Harvesters than MMPs but they were the 50x40 and 50x44 CR. By blown i mean DRILLED. The center was gone.
Sabot petal loss means nothing to me since many of my best loads commonly shed all petals regardless of brand.
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Green Mountain 54-120
ULA Model 20 50cal
Savage MLII SS Pacnor 45
Savage MLII SS/Laminate 50
Finding sabots with blown petals and cups that are not round concerns me. If you look at the cup of the Harvester you can see it is round and bigger in diameter, conforming to the bore upon exit.
The 250 Bloodline also sits better in the Harvester sabot.
I am not a paid ensorser for Harvester, I bought the sabots. Just in case anyone wondered.
Looking at the posts, the broken petals wouldn't concern me if I was getting good accuracy. And, looking at the chrony data in Sabot's post, the velocities did not have much deviation which, to me, indicates a good consistant seal. IMO, I would shoot whatever combo gave me the best accuracy.
__________________ PLEASE NOTE THAT DUE TO THE RISING COST IN AMMO PRICES I WILL NO LONGER BE FIRING A WARNING SHOT.
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Finding sabots with blown petals and cups that are not round concerns me. If you look at the cup of the Harvester you can see it is round and bigger in diameter, conforming to the bore upon exit.
The 250 Bloodline also sits better in the Harvester sabot.
I am not a paid ensorser for Harvester, I bought the sabots. Just in case anyone wondered.
I have found the same as you. As Lee already mentioned, in cold temps the MMP sabots work better. Why, i have no clue.
The 250 Bloodline also sits better in the Harvester sabot.
I am not a paid ensorser for Harvester
You understand that the MMP is designed that way... Del made this change a couple of years back. With this design change the bullet seats itself in the sabot as it is pushed through the crown. But, what it really does is allow the sabot to get a really tight grip on the bullet. This grip insures that the bullet does spin at the same rate as the sabot and prevents the bullet from slippling in the sabot at the point of ignition. Getting the heavier bullet to spin vs the light sabot has caused bullet slippage in the past, especially with the new smooth sided bullet that we sometimes shoot.
The squareness of the cup of the sabot is not a major concern, by the time sabot is stretched to square looking cup it has long ago released from the bullet. The squareness is caused by the force of the air pressure pushing the petals back. This pressure acting on a very hot primer cup conforms to the petals being pushed past 90* and some to the point of breaking off.
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Keep on Shooting Muzzleloaders they are a Blast
Yours did like the Harvester better and it is hotter outside and it was with BH209 which does burn a bit hotter. Sabotloaders shots were in May with T7 so there might be a heat thing. The Harvester did hold up better under hotter conditions. The Harvester Shorts held up great with smokeless in the heat too. The "out of round" part is puzzling for sure. Maybe gas escaping around the skirt?
I seldom shoot in the heat long enough for load work.
My main question for Knight would be which sabot did Knight use for that bullet or is it made just for that bullet?
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Green Mountain 54-120
ULA Model 20 50cal
Savage MLII SS Pacnor 45
Savage MLII SS/Laminate 50
Bloodlines tested
