T-7 vs. APP measurements

ZRider · 11-09-2008, 02:30 PM

Hey all, nice site. Been lingering in the shadows for a while.

I am setting up a CVA Mag Hunter .45 with a 1:28 twist for my wife to hunt with. Shooting a Powerbelt 225 Aerotip, I was using APP standard loose powder and could get no consistency with various amounts of powder from 70 up to 100 grains. I noticed a few posts on here about the APP being the most inconsistent of the new powders so I decided to change to T-7 loose FFFG. I am trying to find out if T7 is measured the same as the other powders on the market, say 70 grains of T7 is equal to 70 grains of APP or Blackhorn209. Should I back my charges down more? Give me a good starting point gentlemen if you can.

Thanks,
ZRider

FG · 11-09-2008, 02:36 PM

T7 is 15% hotter that BP/Pyrodex. APP im not sure.

Try 60gr T7 and top out at 70gr if most of her shooting will be short distance.

Just noticed that you are using 3f T7, Max out at 70gr. I used 80gr 3f t7 and it worked perfect at 50 and 80 yards on 2 deer. With a shot placed behind the shoulder, the deer doesnt stand a chance.

What kind of primers are you using?

ZRider · 11-09-2008, 03:13 PM

T7 primers. Her longest shot will be 100-125 yards and I will be sitting with her so I can back her up if need be. She is not to recoil sensative, she also owns a .308 Win. and shoots it well. I will start it out at 60 and work it up then.

On a side note I am shooting an Optima Pro .50 with a Powerbelt 348 Aerotip with 110 gr. of APP 2f powder right now. After season is over I will also switch this rifle over to T7 3f, any recommendations for a starting load and a max charge for this rifle?

Thanks,
Z

sabotloader · 11-09-2008, 03:14 PM

ZRider

It has been my experiance that APP is one of the weakest powders out there and on the other hand T7 is one of the stronger.

I do not shoot a 45 so I am not familiar with the max loads for that caliber, but as FG says T7-2f is approximately 15% hotter than regular BP or the Pyros... personally I thik it is more like 10% but, compared to APP it might be more like 15%. Moving to T7-3f use dhould reduce the load another 10% - really it creates about the same velocity as T7-2f but it reaches a slighly higher pressure in a quicker period of time.

oldsmellhound · 11-09-2008, 06:22 PM

Zrider, I shoot the same CVA .45 Magbolt, and I use 95 grains FFFG 777. 1.5" groups at 100 yards with (take your pick) .40 cal 200 grain XTP, 200 grain SST or .357 195 grain Dead Center. Last couple seasons I used 80 grains 777. Play around and see what shoots best with your rifle, but I wouldn't be afraid of going up to 100 grains FFFG 777.

On the other hand, if you're planning on staying with the 225 grain Powerbelt, I'd keep the charge to 80 grains max. - many others have proven that if you push PB's too fast, you get less than ideal results.

ZRider · 11-09-2008, 06:28 PM

Thanks for the help guys. Hope to get out Tuesday or Wednesday and try it out.

dmurphy317 · 11-10-2008, 01:31 PM

For comparison sake, in my 50 cal Magbolt 100 gr of 777 2F is about 300 to 400 fps faster than 100 grains of APP 3F using a 300 grain Shock Wave. I've heard but have not tested that it takes 130 to 150 grains of APP to equal 100 grains of 777 in velocity. Good luck to you and your wife.

falcon · 11-10-2008, 03:31 PM

Quote:

For comparison sake, in my 50 cal Magbolt 100 gr of 777 2F is about 300 to 400 fps faster than 100 grains of APP 3F using a 300 grain Shock Wave.

That is about right. A friend has chronographed most smokeless powder subsitutes. According to him 100 grains of 2F JSGis about 100 fps faster thanan equalquantity of APP when used with the 250 grain SST/Shockwave.100 grains of Goex Pinnacle 2F is about 100 FPS faster than 100 grains of 2F JSG. He says that 100 grains of 3F Pinnacle is not far off 100 grains of 2F 777 in velocity.

Tried APP several years ago with results that were not good. Used JSG to very good effect on several deer and 10-15wild hogs. Have since switched to Pinnacle.

ZRider · 11-12-2008, 04:43 PM

Any suggestions for a .50 cal load using the 348 Aerotips. I was shooting 110 gr. of APP and will change to T7 after season.

sabotloader · 11-12-2008, 05:11 PM

ZRider

If you are shooting PB's you will need to reduce your load significantly to keep the PB from fragmenting.

FG is the PB expert here so he can tell you the appropriate charge, but I am thinking 80 grains max... and remember CVA says 100 grains of loose powder max.