BullShop's in a 1:28 GMB

[cayugad]

Since today there was no rain (we need it in the northern end while the southern end of the State is flooded) I decided to shoot (as if that is something new). I decided to shoot the Green Mountain Barrel that is stainless steel and has a 1:28 twist and is mounted on my T/C Renegade. Now this GMB does not have fiber optic sights. It came with a brass front sight and standard adjustable rear sight. I was glad for that.

I took an empty carton from a Diet Pepsi box. I first put a red dot on the side of it and shot my range finder out to 100 yards. I set that up in the steel bullet trap and got out some 300 grain .452 Speer Gold Dots. I wanted to shoot them up and wanted to try them with different powders.

With 110 grains of Pyrodex RS they shot real good. Although to be honest, the 2" sticky bulls eye I put on the box was a waste because I could hardly see it at that distance. But over all with Pyrodex RS the Speer shot a real good group with the open sights. I then marked all those hits and broke out some 2f American Pioneer Powder. I loaded 100 grains of that and sprayed that box all over the place. I could not hold any kind of a group at all. So I broke out 100 grains of Triple Se7en 2f and put five of them in under a 2 inch group. Trouble is the box was so shot full of holes you had to be there to understand the group... so no pictures on that.

I then cleaned the barrel real good and decided to load 70 grains of Triple Se7en 2f and a 460 grain .503 diameter Bull Shop conical. I turned the box so the large white bottom of the carton showed. Since I did not think putting another little red dot on it would do any good. I just told myself to aim for the center of the box. Like it was the kill zone of say an elk or some other large animal (its nice to dream a little) .

The first shot on the clean barrel was a little wild, almost missing the box. Not a confidence builder by any means. Withoutswabbing I shot two more. They actually touched. Now I was getting excited. So I swabbed the barrel but not real good. I shot two more and they hit high, over the two that touched. So I swabbed again a little better then the last time and shot two more. Those hit low, but overall.. not counting that first clean barrel shot, the group was at two and a half inches. I was more then pleased.

So I decided to kick the powder charge up to 80 grains of Triple Se7en 2f. I swabbed the barrel and it shot higher then the others and to the left. Still I guessed it was going to throw them near the others. Then without swabbing I shot two more. I marked the 80 grain hits with an + so I could tell them.

I decided on my next order or when my sizing dies get here, to reduce some of them Bull Shop .503 to about a .502 and then try them. The .503 load OK, but I have to kind of force them in. Not like when loading the White, and I did not expect them to load like my White Ultra Mag..

I think I will mount a 1X scope on this rifle also, and then see just what this rifle is really able to do. It is a good shooting rifle. Although today for some reason I got a lot of hang fires. I have learned to shoot through a hang fire but I really could not explain to myself why they were happening. I was swabbing careful, drying the barrel, although it was hot and humid out. But still, I have shot in that kind of weather before.

I was using Dynamite Noble 1075 RWS caps. I think if it had been the CCI standard caps there would have been a lot of no fires, and maybe some colorful phrases on the range...

But over all it was a great day shooting...

[yeoman]

Outstandingshooting there Cayugad! You've still got it.

[cayugad]

Thanks ... to say I was not pleased with the way the conicals shot today would be a lie. I want to do some more shooting with them and see if some different powder can produce better results. I might try some wads next time and maybe some 3f powder. Also I really want to put a 1X scope on this rifle. I think it would be a lot of fun, and then legal for our muzzleloader season.

[yeoman]

Cayugad - I think we have an opportunity on this site to improve the way we display our target results. The 6 shot open sight group you have there of 2 1/2 inches at 100 yards is better than 90% of all scoped MZ shooters will accomplish in their lifetimes. Many of the guys/gals on this site shooting scopes will do it, but they aren't the norm. They're in that 10%. The problem is perspective. There is no item in your target photo which offers perspective.

I noticed the same problem in Outdoorslover's target post yesterday. By being so close to the target, the "groups" looked spread out. They were not.

One of the best objects to include in a relative-size photo is a human hand. I'm not sure why that is given a variation in hand sizes.

Humor me and post that target again with a hand on it? Don't chop one off for the cause or anything.

I think I might just frame a sub 2 1/2" 100 yd. 6 shot open sight group....should I ever see one!

[wabi]

Nice group with 70 grains!
Were you getting hangfires with all the powders?

[cayugad]

Yeoman.. since hands also come in all sizes, I thought I would put something we could all recognize and relate to. I tried to set the ruler to the outside edges of the furthest holes, so it would help. I should also say, this is not the normal group for me at 100 yards. Like I said, I was very pleased with that group. Then you would subtract the .503 of the conical to get the group... right?

wabi - actually yes, the hang fires were much too common today. It was VERY humid, but like I said, I have shot in this kind of weather before. When I cleaned the rifle I paid special attention to the nipple and bolster. I even too an air compressor to them to be sure they are dry and clear. I want to experiment some more with them.

I did note that the APP had chunked up on me, and I had to shake the jug real hard to break it up. So I am guessing there was some moisture in there, but the Triple Se7en seemed fine... If I had not been shooting RWS caps I think it would have been a real circus today. I finally, even was popping standard CCI caps through the rifle after swabbing to make sure all was dry and clear and that seemed to help a lot.

[yeoman]

That's helpful for sure. And when you realize you could blank those out with a fist, terrific.

Willing to try 200 at the farm down the road?

[wabi]

If it were my barrel I'd probably switch to a musket nipple (or 209 conversion nipple) and see ifit cured the hang fires.
I have a T/C NewEnglander with a .50 and a 12ga barrel. The .50 has handled all the powders (Goex BP, Pyrodex RS, T-7, APP, clean shot, clear shot) with perfect ignition using #11 caps of several brands. The 12ga hang fires all too often with anything but Goex BP. A musket nipple & caps (CCI or RWS)on it gets good ignition with Pyrodex (all I've tried so far).

[cayugad]

It's actually the first time I experienced a hangfire with that rifle... that is why it took me by surprise. I do want to try some different powders like Swiss 3f. And I want to try the same powders again, when it is not so humid and see if that was the reason for the hang fires. At least shooting flintlock has helped me when there is a slight delay between cap and ignition to stay on target.

I really have wondered about the 200 yard shooting with open sights. After seeing what some of the forum members can do at those extreme distances, I do wonder about myself. But I am the first to admit.. I am not a good shot at long distances with open sights. As I said, the reason I did not bother to put a red focus dot on this target is, I would have a hard time seeing it anyway.

I have found with the 1x scope, it acts as a aiming device for me and makes me a better long distance shot with a non magnified sighting device.

[wabi]

Could have been the humidity affecting both the caps and the powder, or it could be somethingunexpected likethe nipple. That can bea bigpart of the fun - trying to figure out what works and what doesn't.
One thing I likeabout muzzleloaders, the variables are plentiful, but it's easy to change the components. I've had little things (like changing brands of nipples) completely alter how a gun performs. I've got a Lyman Plains pistol that will shoot almost any type of powder behind patched balls or conicals accurately, but with a "hot shot" nipple it hangs fire more often than not - even with fffg Goex BP! With a Lyman nipple, never a problem.