Pyrodex vs Triple 7 question

n5638b · 06-03-2007, 05:35 PM

Need some help since I'm a rookie at this. Bought a new CVA Elkhorn last week, went to the range today and had to swab about every 3-4 shots with T7. Shot a pound of Pyrodex in my CVA Buckhorn in the last 6 months and never had to swab it down at the range. I could shoot 20 rounds of Aerotips and had no problem seating the bullets. Today, after 5 shots I could not get the bullet to seat unless I swabbed it down. Any thoughts?
I thought triple 7 was supposed to burn cleaner than Pyrodex. Difference in rifles?? Using the same 209 CCI primer...

frontier gander · 06-03-2007, 06:13 PM

oh man i love the elkhorn! With triple7, some people get lucky while others dont. CVA advises you to swab between each shot when using triple7 or else you experience Mr. crud ring. I havnt shot powerbelts yet, just BS conicals and hornady great plains bullet with triple7 and never got one stuck. And im talking 14- 16 shots before i will swab. Other than this crud ring, how is that elkhorn shooting? I'd really love to pick up one of those rifles. I'd buy some of those great plains bullets to try out in your rifle and see how they shoot.

sabotloader · 06-03-2007, 06:23 PM

n5638b

Quote:

I thought triple 7 was supposed to burn cleaner than Pyrodex. Difference in rifles?? Using the same 209 CCI primer...

Overall, and these are just my thoughts, I consider T7 a better powder than any of the Pyro's... It is cleaner, it is stronger, it is more consistent for me, also less smoke and smell, and it is less corrosive, emphasis on the word less. But, a lot of people do have a problem with what UC calls the crud ring usually showing up deep in the barrel near the load and bullet. There has been a ton of speculation on what might cause this crud ring - some people do not get it at all, while others report really bad ones.... In my case it is almost non-existent in all of my ML's.

One of the theories that has been expressed a lot is that hot primers may be the reason for the formation of the hard ring. Many people have switched primers to cooler primers or even switched ignition systems to help solve the problem. I am shooting Remington 209-4's (410 shotgun primers) and see very little of the crud ring... I also shoot a Austin & Halleck with a 32 HR mag conversion and an Omega with a 25 ACP conversion, both of these ignition systems seem to produce very little crud ring....My speculation has always been that is a reaction with what ever might be in your bore.

Swabbing with regular windex will take care of the problem most of the time really easy. I do swab after every shot, but can shoot 5/6 rounds before seating becomes a problem. I have reconciled this swabbing because that is the condition my bore will be in when I am hunting also.

Just a few of my thoughts....

gleason.chapman · 06-03-2007, 07:00 PM

Quote:

ORIGINAL: n5638b

Need some help since I'm a rookie at this. Bought a new CVA Elkhorn last week, went to the range today and had to swab about every 3-4 shots with T7. Shot a pound of Pyrodex in my CVA Buckhorn in the last 6 months and never had to swab it down at the range. I could shoot 20 rounds of Aerotips and had no problem seating the bullets. Today, after 5 shots I could not get the bullet to seat unless I swabbed it down. Any thoughts?
I thought triple 7 was supposed to burn cleaner than Pyrodex. Difference in rifles?? Using the same 209 CCI primer...

I swab every shot, in field with Bore Butter.At range with 50% mixture of Alchol and Windshield washer fluid, then a dry patch. Manual on Omega says to do it, I have large crud ring at bottom of Omega, no so much on Knight. SabotLoader answered the question well for the cleaness of 777 over Pyrodex. I thought it was 777 compared to BP, not 777 compared to Prodex, but I forget, since I don't shoot prodex any longer.
Chap Gleason

n5638b · 06-03-2007, 07:10 PM

Frontier Gander, It shoots really well as you can see from the pic. Took me a while to figure out it likes 70 grains instead of 100.This target was at 100 yards from the bench rest, open sights. Actually I'm thinking of selling it as it does not shoot any better than the Buckhorn I bought last winter. Thought with the longer barrel and solid bolt I might get even tighter shots. I've got some Pyrodex left, I think I'll try it next time out to compare the crud ring. Your right, it was right at the bottom of the barrel.
Am also planning on trying some Great Plains bullets next time too, just to see! FYI, the small holes were with my .308 w/3x9 scope.....really looking forward to ml season this year!

frontier gander · 06-03-2007, 07:27 PM

I think we i can help you out with that. My winchester shot that group when i was shooting powerbelts. Try 120 grains pyrodex RS, Loose powder. My winchester will hold 1" @ 100 with that load. 295 grain powerbelt.

Love the target! Where can i get one of those?

n5638b · 06-03-2007, 07:31 PM

I buy them out Sportsmans Warehouse in Colorado Springs...Here's the full view. The target is 28"x36".

frontier gander · 06-03-2007, 07:36 PM

Awesome! i'll have to go there next time im in springs. I only live 2 hours south of springs.

IL-Cornfed · 06-03-2007, 08:49 PM

As mentioned, swab the barrel every shot, that's certainly the condition your rifle is going to be in during the hunt. I've tried many of the powders and thus far the APP Shockey's Gold is easily the cleanest I've seen.

frontier gander · 06-03-2007, 09:01 PM

Actually, once its on target. I'd swab every 2 shots so you know where that second shot will go on a dirty bore. Every time i fire a shot in the field, im getting right to work on loading it up again for a quick follow up shot, should one be needed. Of course, once you know how it acts with the #2 shot on a dirty bore, then you can swab for paper accuracy.