Greets fm CO
I would like to hear about your experiences with various Black Powder subs. I have used only Black powder before. I currently have a bottle of Triple Seven but am interested in all. Thanks Ray
Black Powder substitutes have been around a long time in one brand or another. When Pyrodex first came out back in the 80's (or when I discovered it) I thought the muzzleloading world was pretty sweet. It shot well, was easy to get, and since I cleaned my rifle every time I shot, I never knew about the corrosive nature of the beast.
Clear Shot and Clean Shot came on the market and I have to admit, Clear Shot was not the greatest stuff I ever tried. Although some people liked the stuff. Clean Shot which later became APP I shot a lot of and had real good luck shooting it in both inline and traditional rifles.
Triple Se7en was the real wonder powder. 15% stronger in loose form the Pyrodex or Goex. Clean burning in the traditional rifles. Clean up was easy. The big fall back was cost. Now of course we have heard of the dreaded crud ring some people experience. I find a simple swabbing takes care of that problem.
The new one on the market was by Magkor called Black Mag3 I really liked the way it shot. I liked the power. It really seems to have a lot of power compared to Goex, but the recoil is actually very gentle. I liked the clean up. I hate the price and the fact it is so hard to get your hands on. Pinnacle by Goex is another powder that I really like with sabots. With conicals I do not care for it. As for Shockey Gold, I never had the pleasure to shoot it, and probably never will.
After shooting pounds and pounds of substitutes... I think I will stick with Goex and some Triple Se7en in a few choice rifles... I think if you try Triple Se7en you will like it. It works real good. Happy shooting.
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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, a total wreck, screaming Yahoo, with a big smile on your face."
I also have used them all,I don't believe that you can narrow it down to any best. I my experance Black and Pyrodex will work well in all muzzle loaders, the rest depend on several things some of us get "crudring" so bad its not practical to use 777, I had extremly good luck with APP until I got a hold of a bad can, I could not get pinnacle to shoot well in any of my inlines but the Hawken loves it, and other people have good luck with it. Black Mag has two draw backs as far as I am concerned to hard to get and too expensive[to get any to try I had to pay the hazmat fee on top of the already high price], other than that it was excellant.
I would say try them all your rifle may have a lot to do with which one will work the best for you. Lee
Here in the old west and living the sticks finding a variety of Black Powder substitutes is not an easy chore... We can find all the Pryo's and some Goex - but mostly T7. Back before hazmat fees I was able to order Clean Shot - Clear Shot and some otherpowders. Today I shoot Triple Seven in both the 2f and 3f variety. It really does work for me in all of my different ML's - I really do like itsstrength and all of the other advantages, and I have really been fortunate to be able to avoid the dreaded "crud ring" for the most part. And as cayugad says a simple damp patch will take care of that. I have always worried about that QUICK second shot if i needed one - for me there is no QUICK second shot in the field so I might as well run the patch if I need too. But, in realality I can shoot 4-5 shots before I have a real problem.
Good luck in your search - besides the fact it is fun to experiment..
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Keep on Shooting Muzzleloaders they are a Blast
sabotloader,I wish I could understand why I have more trouble than most with 777 a simple damp patch will not clean the curd ring out of either of my inlines. It takes about 5 soaked in cleaner [I have tried several different cleaners]and a couple dry patches. The only thing that helped any was when I polished the barrel with polishing compound. I normally scrub my guns after I shoot them with boiling water with just a bit of Simple Green added and use Sheath aspreseverer, I tried different primers and even musket caps and the crudring is still so bad that it takes 5 minites to get it out. The rest of the barrel is fairly clean the only dirty area is right where the crud ring is.
Any idea what the problem might be? I have heard some people don't get a crud ring as such is that true? Lee
Around here you are mostly stuck with some type of sub unless you can buy real black online and have it shipped. All the local places that used to sell real black no longer handle it. Forget even thinking of looking at the box stores for the real stuff.
I now use T7 even in my side locks. I used to use clean shot before the pellet law suit. I loved that stuff. When it ran out I bought a pound of APP. that was 5 years ago. Couldn't get any type of groups with it then one day I looked at some sabots I picked up and the base was packed full of unburnt powder. I still try to get it to work in different rifles but it doesn't/hasn't so far.
Haven't tried the rest. I keep my supply up with the Wal Mart end of season sales and I get 5 or 6 pounds at more than half off.
Al
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Garden View Apiaries where the view is as sweet as the honey.
Lee, I gotta tell you I honestly do not know why I do not have a real problem... I have several theories but they are just my theories - no basis behind them.
I went along with maybe different breech plug faces were responsible for the ring, I bought into the thought maybe it was the temperature of the ignition - which I now believe can not be because the temp of the ignition is nothing like the temp of the real burn... What I have come down to in my pee-picking mind it is the condition of the barrel in thebreech right behind the projectile. I personally believe it has to do with a reaction of what is in the bore at that point and what it can do to attach itself to the bore or the pores in the bore that are really heated up at that point. For awhile I thought it was a function of the type of steel - Stainless vs Nickel - I now do not think that is a factor.
What I am believing now it is a function of the smoothness of the bore at that point. The smoother the bore (polished) the less crud ring (fowling) because the fowling can not kling to anything. I further expand this thought by removing any type of oil material that the the explosion might react with - have know idea if this has anything to do with any thing. I do the same thing you do clean the bore as clean as possible before shooting. But that is not going to get all the oil in the barrel out. For me I have gone to a windex patch and a couple of dry patches. Then two or three shots - repeat the patch process and from that point I no longer fight the crud ring. That why in my case I go all hunting season without really strip cleaning the bore. I check the sight in with a group of 3-5 shots wipe the barrel out with windex dry it with dry patches and then put back a very thin coat of a good gun oil to protect the bore and it stays that way all season - repeat the process if I shoot it during the season.
The next thing that I thinks makes the major difference for me, and you are not going to like this - but I honestly do think my use of bore butter (the way I use it) makes all the difference. Bore butter is an anti-fowling product - i found that out in my trap guns - I treat the chokes with bb and they do not foul near as bad as they did. Again this is just my theory and most every sain person would disagree - but I continue on my way - and I am very happy that what ever the reason is that I do get the ring - I do not get the ring...
I'll PM you my barrel procedure - it is long and you can make your awn judgements...
Good luck
mike
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Keep on Shooting Muzzleloaders they are a Blast
sabotloader, I still use BB in all my Hawkens I never found any thing else that work as good for PRB also have plenty on hand. Just how do you use it in a sabot gun? The only sabots I have used it with were the breakaway TC. Lee
I have to agree with sabotloader! I use Bore Butter (flame suite on) in ALL my muzzel loaders,and also use 777,in them all. I have the crud ring,but it's not an issue at all. When hunting I use a simple spit patch between shots. The ring cleans out easily,with very little effort. As mentioned above,a smooth bore,helps allot,but I also believe the bore butter treatment dosen't allow the fouling to stick as easy to the bore. I shoot a Grey Hawk 54 cal. with patch,and ball. I use bore butter to lube the patches. I've shot it as many as 20 timesWITHOUT swabing the bore. And the gun keeps shooting into the same group. As far as "seasoning the bore" I think a better term would "conditioning" the bore. I also use it in all my ML for long term storage,and have NEVER had a bore rust. What I have also discovered is when using oil,or petrolum products is,that unless cleaned extreemly well,the oil film will cause a COKE,or hard ash deposit in the bore. I've also noticed that the guns "seasoned" with bore butter clean up allot easier.
Black Powder Subs
Al
