Looks like to me that most every one with a crud ring problem with trip 7 is useing the pellets. Also appears that if the primer is toned down that the crud ring disappears or is at least reduced.
Any comments?
Al
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Garden View Apiaries where the view is as sweet as the honey.
Ya gotta bend over backwards and jump thru flaming hoops, spit patch between every round, take short strokes while wet patching to ensure ya don't get the patch and rod stuck, then ya gotta find just the right EXPENSIVE primers, or retrofit your breech plug to use small rifle primers at about $80 bucks, then back off the powder so as not to blow yourself up--This is what ya get when you take Smokeless Powder and add Charcoal till it just barely produces some smoke. And then there's that Crud Ring again, and again and again
All this work just to MAKE a powder work for you????? [:@][:'(][][:-][&:]
Just get APP/Goex Pinnacle/Shockey's Goldin the 3Fg granulation and be done with all the gyrations of nasty 777.
Powder, bullet, load, cap, fire, repeat over and over without swabbing for over 45 shots, 2 wet patches, 2 dry patches, and pack'er up and take her home. It's that easy!
LaneNebraska, Iagree I tried everything including musket and #11 THEN I tried APP FFF it fell short of heavy enough loads to suit me and still get accuracy so I tried FF even though some people were complaining about the way it poured or what it poured through or something. I though it was some kind of fluck at first or that I was missing the whole paper with some shots but after a while I learned when you get it right and your with in 10 gr of the right load with APP FF with a good bullet it will sit there and pokem in the same hole all day if you dont screw up. Iquit trying to tell the ones stuck on 777 anything some people like to fight in the ring some like to fight to make something work just because they tried it first, thats ok its the good old USA where they are allowed to be as smart or notor as stubborn or whatever they want, just so it don't rub off. Lee
Looks like to me that most every one with a crud ring problem with trip 7 is useing the pellets. Also appears that if the primer is toned down that the crud ring disappears or is at least reduced.
Any comments?
Al
Crud rings appear even with loose powder. Triple Se7en priduces a harder then average crud ring if you compare it to other powders. All powders leave one type of fowling to some degree. And yes, if you tone down the heat of the primer it does seem to help but then you have to be careful you do not under power the igntion or that has its own set of problems. Also the degree of the ring seems to change with the different brands of rifles.
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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, a total wreck, screaming Yahoo, with a big smile on your face."
I have only shot loose 777 and it makes a terrible crud ring in my gun. Black mag3 and APP don't leave crud rings, but won't shoot accruately in my gun. Going back to pyordex to see if accuracy improves.
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Venor ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
I've never have a problem with the crud ring when using 777. It does great in my rifle. I do have a buddy who's rifle does get the crud ring with 777 though. He started using APP and seems to like it.
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"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have."...Thomas Jefferson
ya your "pyordex" mite shoot better but dont for get to clean between
shots . i have had a ram rod stuck and i know 3 others that have theres stuck as well .and if you dont have a breech plug in that gun of yours you'll find it all but imposable to get out. 2 of the guys that i know took out the nipple put in just a pinch of power, like 4-6 little kernels ,and shot the ram rod out. that ram rod went 40 yds
ya your "pyordex" mite shoot better but dont for get to clean between
shots . i have had a ram rod stuck and i know 3 others that have theres stuck as well .and if you dont have a breech plug in that gun of yours you'll find it all but imposable to get out. 2 of the guys that i know took out the nipple put in just a pinch of power, like 4-6 little kernels ,and shot the ram rod out. that ram rod went 40 yds
Stuck ramrods are easy to avoid. First off be careful of the size of the patch. Next, never push a dry patch down a fowled barrel of a rifle. Its the best way to get the ramrod stuck. Also when swabbing the bore work in short strokes. I like to move about 2 inches at a time down the bore and back up. Also a T handle on one end of the ramrod is an easy way to pull a stuck rod out. You step down on the T or hang it from a tree branch then pull the rifle straight away. Once the barrel is swabbed of the major fowling, then you can put a dry patch down the bore, but again... all the prior mentioned rules apply.
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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, a total wreck, screaming Yahoo, with a big smile on your face."
I have one gun that almost never has a crud ring with 777 loose and a newer gun that gets it bad on every shot. The biggest difference between the 2 is the breachplugs. The one that seldom get a CR has a BP that allows some blowback, the other is more sealed. My guess is that the blowback may serve to lower the effectiveness/strength of the primer. It does not matter what kind of primer I use in the first gun, it shoots to basically the same point and avoids the CR no matter what primer I use. The sealed BPhas the CR no matter what primer I use.
Another theory I have. I use antiseize as a BP lube and Breakfree in the bore after cleaning. I usually have a small amount of antseize that gets onto the face of the BP that I just wipe off before installing it, I don't scrub it off just give it a quick wipe. I suspect that a little of the antiseize may be getting into and coating the bore near the combustion chamber. This may be still there even after swabbing the bore with a couple of dry patches before loading at the range and thus conditioning the bore such that it is less likely for the crud to stick to it. I do notice that the BP face is easy to clean and I have not had any issues with the BP sticking, even after 30 to 40 rounds using 777 the BP comes out with little more than finger pressure on the removal tool.
The newer gun has only been to the range once so it has not had a chance for this "conditioning" to occur. I know this theorygoes against all the "completely clean/dry bore before loading" standard practices, and I do swab untill the patches come out dry before loading, but I wonder if there might be a little "conditioning" left in there that may be helping in the crud ring department. Just a thought.
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David
Only one man in a thousand is a leader of men -- the other 999 follow women.
Groucho Marx
I've used 777 in my Encore for three years now. The first year, I shot only pellets, after that, just loose. I did have crud rings at first. Nothing like what some of you describe though. The only thing I changed is I clean my gun only with a product called ballistol. Many folks that shoot real black powder use it in long range and other competitions.
I don't really do anything other than that. Use 130 grains of 777 under a 250 grain shockwave sabot and a regular winchester primer. My gun stays loaded for no more than 5 days during the season, I either shoot it or unload it through the breach if it gets longer. When I shoot my gun now, I have very little crud ring. I have experienced what others have with ballistol. It "seasons" the barrel and seemingly makes it easier to clean.
I won't be changing guns, powder, primer, or sabots any time soon and neither will many of my friends.
That trip 7 crud ring?
Al
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