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Old 06-22-2006, 10:45 PM   #1
Fork Horn
 
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Default Help me with this muzle loader

Well just bought my first black powder rifle through a local gun store. The guy had no information on it and couldnt help me out with any questions.

There is no marking on the rifle at all and on the barrel it reads
"Ardesa Spain 50 Cal Black Powder Only"

Can any one tell me what I got here and if I can use pyrodex. Also how can I find out the rate of twist for the rifle?


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Old 06-22-2006, 11:24 PM   #2
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

Yes of course you can use pyrodex in it. As to the barrel twist I would guess it to be 1-66 or 1-48 you will have to check it to be certain. What's the barrel length on that rifle. Usually if they have a real long barrel they are more incline to be 1-66 twist which is for shooting roundball. The full stock Kentucky style rifles were usually (but not always) 1-66. As they became more in line with other rifles, some of them began showing up with 1-48 twists.

I'd start with a .490 ball and patch combination and keep the powder charges under 100 grains of 2f and you should be fine. With about 80-90 grains of powder if it is a 1-66 twist the rifle will probably tune in. Also it should shoot good with about 40-50 grains for plinking rounds...

To find the rate of twist, put a cleaning jag on the end of your ramrod. Put a tight patch on the jag and push that to the bottom of the barrel. Take white out, and mark the ramrod and the end of the muzzle. Now pull the jag up slowly, letting the ramrod turn at will with the rifling. When it makes 1/4 of a turn measure that distance from the dot to the top of the muzzle. Now you can figure the twist. A rifle with a 1-66 twist, the dot on the ramrod would make a 1/4 turn in approximately 16.5 inches. If the rifle has a 1-48 twist it would make that quarter turn in approximately 12 inches of space between the dot and the rifle. Now granted this is not 100% positive, instead of 1-66 it might be 1-60 but it will give you a working approximation...

Good luck with the rifle. There are a lot of Spanish gun makers that sent rifles through one company or another to the United States for sale...


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Old 06-23-2006, 01:26 AM   #3
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Spot Light

Well just bought my first black powder rifle through a local gun store. The guy had no information on it and couldnt help me out with any questions.

There is no marking on the rifle at all and on the barrel it reads
"Ardesa Spain 50 Cal Black Powder Only"

Can any one tell me what I got here and if I can use pyrodex. Also how can I find out the rate of twist for the rifle?

That is the Traditions Kentucky with 32" barrel & 1-66" twist. Shoots rouundballs and Buffalo Ballets best. Very seldom should you take the pins out to remove the barrel from the stock.

Find a long, flexibleaquarium air hose & attach it to the nipple for water flushing. You will need a 2nd nipple for this. Grab a drill and drill bit that will make your bottom nipple hole as large as the top hole. This will allow more water to pass thru the nipple. Never use this nipple for hunting afterwards. Always keep it with the air hose.

Run hot water thru a funnel & into the bore -- letting the air hose catch the water & dispense into a bucket. I tied a string around the air-hose & old cracked ramrod I had laying around for better stabilization - so the end of the air-hose stays in the bucket when water-flushing the nipple powder channel & nipple drum. Do all this powder channel water-flushing after you cleaned the bore with solvents -- then dry thoroughly before using gun oils for rifle storage.

After you are done water-flushing, remove the nipple & drum cleanout screw -- then use pipe cleaners & Q-tips dampwith solvent to clean the two holes there.

Before you go to the range, run gun grease in/all around the cracks between the stock & barrel - to seal-out any moisture and blowback from fouling. You should only remove the stock from the barrel around every 300-400 shots.

Hope this helps!
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Old 06-23-2006, 05:50 AM   #4
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

WOW you guys rock.....thought it would take 4-ever for an answer. Im a newbie to the blaock powder world but really excited to get into it. Sorry for another question, but why shoulnd't I remove the barrel for regular cleaning?
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Old 06-23-2006, 06:13 AM   #5
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/eshop/products/TRADITIONS%20SIDELOCK%20BOOK1.pdf

Manual... it's laid out in poor order, but I guess if you print it out you can then arrange it properly.
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Old 06-23-2006, 06:56 AM   #6
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Spot Light

WOW you guys rock.....thought it would take 4-ever for an answer. Im a newbie to the blaock powder world but really excited to get into it. Sorry for another question, but why shoulnd't I remove the barrel for regular cleaning?
I consider a pinned-in barrel to be a real pain to take out of the stock because of the pins. In addition, taking the pins out and re-inserting them a lot will eventually enlarge the pin holes through the stock making them fit loose, and this can adversely affect accuracy.

If you use that tube-nipple arrangement to make sure you don't get water between the barrel and stock, disassembly can be minimized.

My caplock rifles have a cleanout screw in the drums, so I put a patch over the nipple, lower the hammer to hold it in place, remove the cleanout screw, and pour two quarts of boiling water through the bore and let it drain out the cleanout hole. Then a quick wipe of the HOT! bore with four or five clean, dry patches removes all fouling! After it cools, I swab the bore with a patch wet with Birchwood-Casey SHEATH. The bore is now clean, preserved until your next shooting session, and the SHEATH does NOT have to be swabbed out of the bore before you canload up and start shooting next time. (This method is for Black Powder AND ALL substitute powders like Pyrodex, etc.)

I wrap a towel around the barrel at the muzzle endand twist up the end of the towel tightly for a handle while doing this, so no hot water gets on my hand, the outside of the barrel, or the rifle stock.

Here's a drum with a cleanout screw...The threaded section on the left is screwed into the barrel breech.





Welcome to the black powder community! Good luck. I'm sure you will enjoy black powder - it's lots of fun!
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Old 06-23-2006, 08:17 AM   #7
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Underclocked

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/eshop/products/TRADITIONS%20SIDELOCK%20BOOK1.pdf

Manual... it's laid out in poor order, but I guess if you print it out you can then arrange it properly.
The reason you do not remove the pinned barrels is as already described. The stock to barrel fit gets loose over time and the accuracy suffers.

A friend I hunt with has the same rifle. That is one tack driving rifle and it does not seem to care if he is shooting 30 grains or 100 grains. I know first hand it will drop a deer with a roundball in its track (other then the deer jumped six feet straight into the air and then crashed back down to the ground when he shot) at just over 100 yards.

My friendtook a second nipple, drilled it out, then took plastic fish tank hose and epoxy glued it to the nipple. On the other end of the hose he out a large lead sinker and glued the hose to that. He just puts the replacement nipple in the rifle with the hose attached, drops the sinker into a bucket of boiling hot soap and water and and pumps the hot water through the bore until the rifle is clean. Then he bore brushes the barrel with solvent and repeats the bath. After that, he dumps the dirty water and pours boiling hot water through the rifle to clean out the soap, which catches in his galvanized bucket.. After that he does the bore butter smearing.. and has not complained of a single problem with it's use.
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Old 06-23-2006, 11:59 AM   #8
 
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

ya !!!!!!!! these guy's do rock !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

very nice rifle !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

early
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Old 06-23-2006, 12:50 PM   #9
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

WOW looks like I posted in the right place....so thanks agian and inaticipation to asking many MANY more questions THANKS. One thing however the barrel is held in place by only two screws, one in the brass fixture at the end of the barrel and one that goes through into the trigger assembly. I migh be far off with my black powder virginity but there doesn't seem to be any pins involved???
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Old 06-23-2006, 12:53 PM   #10
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Default RE: Help me with this muzle loader

look up on the fore stock of the rifle where your non trigger hand will normally support the rifle. There should be two places where you will see small brass (usually)pins through the stock if I remember that rifle correct. Triple Se7en might have more detail for you on pin location.
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